Networking Unleashed: Building Profitable Connections. An Interview with George Torok and Michael A Forman
- mforman521
- Aug 21
- 20 min read
📍 📍 📍 📍 And what if I told you that in today's competitive environment, superior communication isn't optional, it's your differentiator. My guest today is a master of helping people deliver messages that land with power, purpose, and profit. He believes that inferior. Doesn't win. And in this episode you're going to find out exactly what that means for your next pitch presentation or conversation.
I. Whether you are networking in a room full of strangers or speaking on a stage with high stakes, this conversation will help you out. Speak up and secure real results. Let's dive in. Now before I introduce George, I just wanna say that. This is exactly what I talk about. This is exactly what I do, what I'm so passionate about.
When I go on stages, when I go into companies he's the real deal. So I would like to introduce George Torah, and he has such a vast background. I'm gonna let him introduce himself. But George, why don't you take it away. Thank you, Michael. Delighted to be talking with you and your listeners here on Networking Unleashed, and everyone starts somewhere.
Michael and I started out as a shy and introverted student. Now those are two separate aspects. Some people confuse them, but shyness is a learned behavior, which means it can be unlearned. Introversion versus extroversion. I define as where you get your energy. I'm still an introvert. I know what to do. I can go to the networking events.
I can st and when it's time I can stand up on a stage and speak to people and I enjoy that and I'm drained after. Totally wears me out. So that's where I started. And I and it actually started to change when I was in high school because I wanted to become popular, but I was afraid to stand out. So I pushed myself to, to be bold to stand up, to answer questions in class, to ask the teacher questions, to walk up to that girl and talk to her.
Ew, ew, she's gonna hurt me. No. She's not gonna make fun of me. And I got over that, but it was a struggle. And later in my career, I learned to communicate more effectively. And I'll tell you what the big change was. I attended a two day workshop on presentation skills. And I went to that shop workshop thinking, ah, in fact, my boss said, you don't need this.
You're already good enough. And I thought yeah, I'm good enough. And I went to the workshop and I came away with two big ahas. One, I wasn't as good as I thought I was. I. And I had to discover that myself. No one could tell me that. And two, I learned that effective communication is a skill set.
And it's based, it's techniques that are based on principles and the techniques can be learned, adapted to your style. But it's all skill. It's not natural talent. And anyone can learn to become a better communicator. And and if you don't, you're gonna get, be left behind. Absolutely. I can't.
You, you made so many great points, but the most important thing is that networking communication is a skill and a talent. Okay? So you have to, and what do you do when you have to? What do you have to do to get better at a skill? What do you have to do when with a talent? You have to practice, practice and practice, and then when you're finished with that, you have to practice again.
Okay, so I've developed about 10 questions that I'd like to ask you, but I'm really interested in your answers because each one is something that I talk about. So I'm very interested to hear you talk about communication being a differentiator. How can professionals use this edge to stand out when networking in crowded industries, I.
People will remember you based on how they felt when they met you and when you had a conversation with them. And that will be determined by how you communicated with them. And I'll I'll give you an example of a recent con conversation at a networking event. I attended the person said to me, he thought he was being, perhaps he thought he was being clever. So his opening statement was what brings you here today? And I said, and I could have said my car, or it could have been funny and said, my steed, but instead I said, curiosity. Curiosity and the search for a positive conversation.
And he looked at me and he didn't know what to say. He had no follow up. So he started the conversation, what he thought was a clever question, but he didn't know how to continue it. And so it we picked up the conversation at some point, but it went through this flat part. So be prepared to listen to people and he could have responded with, oh that's different.
What makes you curious, George? And so pick up on what people say and engage them and they'll remember you. And I don't remember the guy's name and if I see him again, I'm probably not gonna go walk over to him because I just, he left me with a yucky feeling I. Right. That's right.
And the important thing that you said was that you had to have active listening. Active listening is so important because you have to respond to what the person is asking you, not the next thing that you want to say. So when he got confused. Because he tried to come out of his little bag of tricks of what to say and you just hit 'em right back.
So that's very good. And I'll have to remember that. Okay, so what are the most common mistakes people make when presenting themselves at networking events and how can they avoid them? One of the, one of the most common mistakes is that they think it's all about them. That they're there to give their 32nd or two minute or pitch about, here's what I do, here's what I sell.
Gimme your card. And get lost, get outta my face. This is the feeling that I have when that happens. And here's another per, I remember the person approached me and they start talking to me, but while they're talking to me, their eyes are looking up. They're going up like this. And I realize that what they were doing is they weren't talking to me.
They were reading the script that they had memorized in their head. So that's all they were there for. And then when they're done, I just looked at them and said that's interesting. What so the first thing is. It's not about you. It's about making connections. And connections means building a relationship.
And another mistake is to write people off because you think, oh, this person isn't a client for me. I'm not gonna talk to them. I'm not gonna waste my time with them. Guess what? That person might introduce you to someone else, or they might simply give you energy when you arrive the next time because you already have a connection.
So those are a couple of the mistakes. And the third mistake is not following up because it's about a relationship. And can you imagine if you can you imagine getting married and, the first year you the year later after the mayor, you have a first anniversary and you give your spouse flowers and a card and all that, and you think, okay, that's done.
I don't have to do that anymore. Don't work that way. That's a good analogy. I haven't thought about it that way. Follow up is so important. It's more important, I think, than actually meeting the person, by the way. But the follow up and the way you do it and what you do is so very important and you brought it out.
That's a great analogy. I'm gonna, if you don't mind, I'm gonna have to steal that. Okay. All yours. It's free. It's a gift. Okay. Okay so you say inferior doesn't win. What are the signs that someone is delivering in an inferior presentation or bitch and how do they level up fast? A sure sign is when it's, when it, they're talking about, it's all about themselves.
And I know I'll give you another example. I attended a webinar the other day and 10 minutes in. The speakers are still introducing each other. I, I and I used to show up early for those type of webinars, but now I know to show up at least a couple minutes in so I can skip that nonsense.
But 10 minutes in, they're still introducing each other. They're talking about themselves. I don't care. That's not why I showed up. So stop talking about yourself and make it about the audience real quick. Engage the other. Person quickly and make it about them. And here's an, here's a tip to make your presentation more about your listener, your audience.
Use the word you. So here's what this means to you. Here's how you can benefit. Here's what you can do or has this ever happened to you? So speak to them as if you're speaking. So if you're speaking to an audience, speak to them as if you're speaking to one person and use the same, if you're speaking to one person, you're speaking to one person, but use the word you and stop using the word I.
If the speaker's using the word I a lot. They're into themselves. That's very good. And I would say that in, in my presentations, I use the word you because I always believe that I'm talking to one person. I may be talking to 10, 20, 50, a hundred, 200. I. 300, but I always use the word you.
So that's very good. I hope everybody that's listening is listening to George because he knows what he's talking about. Listen to what he's saying and use you in your presentations and Michael, I'll add one point to that. Don't say you guys yuck. That's so gang talk. That's gang talk street talk. You don't talk to people, you guys, I.
Especially when you're trying to be inclusive, right? Inclusive meaning men and women. So if you say, you guys, most of the women will say, all right I understand he's saying it to the masses, but some of them may say what about me? So Absolutely. You're a hundred percent correct. In your experience, how does a powerful presentation translate into profitable connections?
And can you share a specific story? Ah, the, an effective presentation leaves people knowing what to do next. I. I'll, and I'll give you, I'll give you an example of a, actually a client that I helped this client was pitching for a $10 million contract and they had been failing in their presentations recently, so I coached him on this and we spent.
Three days together working on this presentation, and initially he had a 60 minute presentation because they said, you've got 60 minutes, guess what? You don't need to fill it. When we cre recreated his presentation, it was 12 minutes long. He's got 60 minutes, but, and 12 minutes wasn't a magic number, it's just that we were recreating the presentation.
We got to that point and I realized that was all he needed to say. And this is what many people don't realize. Say less, say the minimum that you need to say to get the results that you want. And in this case, he delivered his 12 minutes. Now they had, can you imagine the committee listening to him and going, wow, the man's done in 12.
This is fabulous. I like this guy already. And they spent the rest of the time asking him questions. So it became. More of a conversation than a pitch. Very good. And if you keep it conversational, then that will also keep the attention of the people involved. Okay. So let's give me your top strategies for making a lasting first impression, whether in person, on stage, or even in Zoom.
Ah. Different environments, but there are some similar similar techniques. First of all, connect with people and when, so for example, when you're on stage. Make eye contact with people. Now what if you got a hundred, 500 people in a room? A thousand people, you might I can't look at everybody.
Yes, but they, it's not who you looked at, it's who believed you looked at them. So if you look off to the, to, to the one side here, you're looking at that person over there, that five or six or maybe 10 people around them believe you looked at them. So talk to them for a sentence. Or two, and then move your eyes over here to another part of the room.
So by the end of the presentation, everyone feels that you looked at them, and therefore were talking directly to them. Now, when you're in Zoom, of course you need to spend the time looking into the camera, not the screen, because you think I'm looking at them. No, you're not. It doesn't look. That way you're gonna look at the camera, which is hard to do.
It's a training but the audience needs to believe that you looked at them. Another technique is to engage people throughout. Our attention span is so short today that you need to engage people every, it depends how many seconds or minutes you need to engage them. And there's two. Main ways you engage people.
One is changes in your delivery, and two is by involving them. And one of the best techniques that actually uses both of those methods is to tell stories that involve them, that they can see themself involved in. So there are a few of the ideas to connect with people, and of course, start on time. And even if you didn't start on time because the mc was late, you finish on time and maybe a little bit early.
I watched a speaker at an event. They were, they had five minutes to speak. They spoke for 15, and then they said at the end, oh, oops. We went a little over time. No, you didn't. You went three times over. And why would you think it was little? And so finish on time or a little bit early and people go, whoa, that wasn't so bad.
That's right. That's right. And when you try to engage your audience I always have them, ask 'em a question, have them raise their hand. I. Or something else like that. And I always try to engage. I think, my audience, the bigger audience last year was about 300 people and I broke it up into four segments sections and I just crossed my eyes and I stared right at their, at the people.
And everybody thought I was looking at them, but I didn't see anybody. But that was just me. Okay. How does one balance authenticity with professionalism in high stakes networking or speaking situations? Ah, and I'm, that's a terrific question to ask because some people say they, some people for example say, oh, I don't rehearse because I want to be natural.
Guess what? Anyone who's good at what they do and any kind of performance. Whether it's music, dance, the sport, sporting world, do you think those people who are out there playing those sports, those multimillion dollar athletes don't rehearse, don't practice? You think that the great pianists of the world don't play scales to rehearse to get their fingers working?
Of course they do. That's how they come across natural. But see, too many people stop rehearsing too early. So first of all is to remember to rehearse and then, ah. But stay real. Be in the moment just because you are on, you are the performer, you're on stage. Stop thinking of yourself as a star. Because the audience will feel it.
And I watched a presentation last week where one person told his story. One of the speakers just told his story of how he built his business and the challenges they had and the problems, and was he dynamic? No. However. He was real. And when he was telling his story of struggle and then this happened and that went wrong, and we're thinking, holy crap, how does he keep going?
How does he have the perseverance? I don't know if I could do it. So we felt him, his story, another speaker spoke and gave us wonderful insights, yet he had an attitude. He had a, an attitude that just, ugh oh, he's not someone that I would want to sit and have coffee with because he would spend the whole time talking about himself.
So make connect with the audience. You are not the star. Your audience is the star. Absolutely. And I was just gonna say that I always make the audience the star, right? But I go into networking communication with what's called a servant's heart. I. I'm always looking to give and not to receive. Now people say you go to a networking event and you're looking to sell either your widgets or whatever the case may be.
Take that completely out of your mind. The people that I coach, I tell them all the same thing. Go in there looking to give, to be that source for somebody, that's gonna be the referral source for two people. And you'll get so much more out of it when you're looking to give, not receive. So that's my main story, and that's powerful advice.
And more people need to understand that the the grease, if you assume that networking is a machine, the lubrication, the grease that keeps it working is helping other people. Absolutely. Absolutely. Okay, let's talk about energy and delivery. What should networkers know about tone, pace, and presence when they communicate?
Your voice. It says a lot about how you feel it, it says whether you are excited. It says whether you are being positive or whether you are maybe being deceptive or even feeling not confident, but what you're saying. So your tone your pace. So for example. And it's not necessarily how you feel, it's how the audience perceives the message.
So for example, if you are chattering away at me a mile a minute, and I have barely have a time to listening to what you're saying, I'm trying to digest what you're saying, but you're going so fast that I can't even de decipher. That's annoying and it strikes me. It comes across as you are obviously nervous talking about this topic, especially if you just keep talking without pausing.
So for example, some people believe that they can't have any blank spaces, can't have any pauses in there, but the reality is the pauses. Give you a chance to breathe, and it gives the audience a chance to digest what you just said. And if you can demonstrate that you can stop talking for two or three seconds, the audience feels more comfortable because it's not like you're trying to ramp something down our throat.
Absolutely. And what I used is a good rule of thumb comedians comedians have a great presence. They pause at the right time. They actually wait for something back from the audience. And, I follow a lot of comedians, and when they're on stage and something doesn't work, they look at and they say, okay, that didn't work, so I'm gonna write that down.
And they move on. So if you make a mistake it's not the end of the world. You made a mistake. But when you are active listening. And you respond to what they said, pause. And I read an entire book about the pause after you listen. Because it is so very important.
It does a, give them time to digest what you have said and also gives you time to respond to what they said. It, it serves multiple purposes, but the pause is so very important with the pace and your tone always, you raise your voice, you lower your voice, you raise your voice, you lower your voice, but you have to do it in such a way.
But yes very good. Very good. Okay, so here's a good one. What role does storytelling play in effective communication, especially when trying to build meaningful business relationships? Stories. Stories make the difference between success and failure. No question. Stories engage us. Stories stimulate our imagination.
Stories build trust. Story, the best stories. Are ones that create a visual in the mind of your listener and trigger an emotion. At the least, at least one of those, either an an emotion or a visual. But those are the best stories and people need to see themselves in your stories. And I'll give you a quick example.
I was speaking to a group of entrepreneurs and this was, this was actually some years ago, and IUI told a story about my teenagers, about the challenge of the teenagers. Now, the interesting fact, the reason that I told the teenager story is because I, at the time, I looked young for my age and I wanted the audience to know that I was old enough to have teenagers.
So I worked in the story about teenagers and the frustration and, communication. And I know I connected. Because after my presentation, people came up to me and started telling me about their teenagers.
That's how, make sure, yep. That's how you know you connected with them. That's very good because you had a connection with the people you were speaking to. And that, of course is the ultimate goal. But I feel that the storytelling, it can't be too long. Can't, the story can't take up a half an hour.
But if you have that quick story and if you have a few stories, I use slides when I present. But I have a few stories that I keep in my back pocket for those audiences that, that it's appropriate for. But I feel that storytelling is a very important part of presentation, networking and everything else.
Not as much with networking because it networking. You don't have that time, unless it's a one-on-one, something like that. But yes, that's very good. Okay. What do you recommend to someone who struggles with speaking confidently in front of others, especially when trying to make a connection that counts?
First of all, realize that feeling anxious. Or nervous when speaking to other people, whether it's one person, a half dozen or a few hundred. Feeling anxious is normal. So if you have experienced any form of anxiety, nervousness, you're normal. Okay? You're normal. Get over it. You're not the only person in the world.
Now, here's something to keep in mind. Here's a question to think about. Is it more important to feel confident or to appear confident? And people, some, I ask this question of some of my audiences, and people say they want both. That's nice, but you can't always have both. And there will be those moments when you have those.
Pangs of anxiety. The audience, the listeners don't need to know. They don't need to know. And so what if you stumble, you make a mistake, big deal. We'll actually like you more when you appear imperfect like us. When you appear human. Stop trying to be super person. You're not super person. And even superman, head kryptonite.
It's okay to be imperfect. It's okay to be nervous, and if you stumble, you trip on a word. Don't worry about it. Just smile. So here's the secret. When you're feeling nervous, smile. Now, you won't feel like smiling. You won't. But make a small smile. And guess what? When you smile, and especially if you smile, just after you stumbled, people look at you and go, oh.
The speaker's got it. Under control. There's no problem. Look, he's smiling. He's everything's okay. But if you make a mistake and you frown and go, oh my God. Oh, you, oh, I made a mistake. They'll know. You don't want them to know. You just show them that you're just delivering your presentation and there's little stumbles in there just to make you look human and just be human.
Absolutely. And I have found that owning the mistake, I, and I've made, I can't tell you how many mistakes I've made, right? But I just said, oh, that one's on me, and I just went, moved on and went over it. And that's the best. And the audience reacts to that. They say, oh, he's got, that type of thing.
And it's been like a lot of things. I was on a stage one time that the floor. Felt, it's like a two foot floor, a false floor. And it fell through and, and I'm sitting there and I'm looking down and I'm looking up at them. I said, boy I'm feeling mighty low, and I got up onto the stage and I just moved on.
Because it happens, things happen. But I'll give you an instance. Of what I heard of a, this was a speaker many years ago was on stage and they tripped and they fell down. And of course the audience went who they're worried about this person and the person while they're down, they said, I guess I'll now take questions from the floor.
And of course the audience burst out into laughter because they knew he was okay and he got up, dusted himself off and he was able to carry on. That's great. That's a great line. I hope I remember something like that, if ever happens to me. And here's something to keep in mind, the more you.
You speak in front of people, the more likely you're gonna have things go wrong. Whether it's a technical problem or a technical problem is most common. But it could be a disturbance from the next room. It could be something happening in, a chair falls over, could be a server, drops a plate of food.
Think of those instant instances ahead of time and prepare a line. And it doesn't have to be tremendously funny. It, it, it could be, and it's easy. Go pick a line from a popular movie or a song or something in, in the, in the news that you can use. And people will think, they'll laugh.
They'll think You were so clever, but you prepared this line. Years ago you had it ready? You had it. Oh, beam me up Scotty, you've been waiting to say that line for years. And it's true. You have to seem as though it's off the cuff, but you're prepared for it for years. You may never use it, but you have it in your little bank of lines yeah.
All right. So let's bring this podcast full circle. If a listener wants to become a must remember communicator starting today. What's the first small change they should make and how should they speak or present themselves?
This is a combination. Say less, listen more.
Yes. I'll give you another example of a client I was working with. He's presenting to a group his, the services that he provides and it's it related and it can help them save costs. And he sent me his slide deck and of course, the first three, four slides were all about him and who we are, history.
And I said, get rid of that. Throw it out. No one wants that. They don't care. I said, instead I said, why? Why are you. Talking to this department. They're the biggest department in the spending biggest budget in your organization. I said, okay, so you wanna connect with them on that. So start with something that means something to them.
Your first slide will have the amount of their budget, the number go. Go look it up, find out the number. It's the biggest. So put that on. And if it's a rough, if it's approximation, fine. So you put that up and you tell 'em, here's how much that's been budgeted or was spent last year. And then the next slide is the promise that you make.
How much money you're gonna save them. Now you got them.
Yeah. That's true. Now I, with networking communication, we say that if you do it properly, you're going to make X dollars more than what you made last year. So that's very, 'cause that puts it in their head immediately that saying, okay, I better listen because either A, I'm gonna save a hundred thousand dollars, or B I'm gonna make a hundred thousand dollars.
Whatever the case may be. But put that, I learned that if you put what you want to say. Really in the first slide or second slide, it grabs her attention. It's okay, I'm listening to this now because I'm gonna learn this. And yeah. So that's very true. Very good. Okay, so that's the, your, the last thing you want to say, George.
This was it. First of all, it was enlightening for me because I learned so much about presentation, about networking, and even though. I'm the person that's going around and talking. I learned. So what does that tell all of my listeners? Practice. You never know where you're gonna get more information and whether I use it or not is up to me, but I'll probably use 90% of what you said.
So if anybody listening would like to get hold of you either to be coached or whatever else for business, or even just to say hi, how can they get hold of you? Two ways, Michael and thank you for that offer. They, you can find me on on LinkedIn. That's where I'm most active, and it's George Toro.
And you can also visit the website speech coach for executives.com. That's speech coach for executive.com. You can read the blog posts or over a hundred posts there of tips and ideas, and you can contact me directly through there as well. And we can have a chat. And if you're interested in. If you're thinking about improving your presentation, your communication, and you want to find out what coaching would look like, we can have an initial 20 minute call, whether that's phone or on Zoom, just to explore.
No obligation, just reach out to me. Very good, George, this was outstanding. I was looking forward to this podcast for so long, and I'll talk to you real soon. My pleasure.
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Michael is a business networking expert specializing in enhancing professionals' networking and communication skills to drive profitability. As a leading authority in this field, he is highly sought after for his dynamic presentations and workshops. His extensive experience has consistently led to significant improvements in corporate profitability by empowering individuals and organizations to connect more effectively and efficiently.
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