Networking Unleashed: Building Profitable Connections. An Interview with Harlan Hammack and Michael A Forman
- mforman521
- Aug 15
- 21 min read
📍 📍 Welcome back to Networking Unleashed, building Profitable Connections, where we go to Beyond Handshakes and dive into the conversations that create real impact. Today's guest is someone who brings the perfect blend of strategy and soul to the small business world. He's a speaker, coach and advocate for entrepreneurs known for helping leaders find the courage to lead, unlock their cash flow, and face the biggest challenges business owners encounter head on.
But here's the question. How does networking play into all that? How do the right relationships help unlock revenue, resilience, and real growth? We're about to find out, so get ready for a conversation full of wisdom, real talk, and tangible takeaways because today we're not just talking business, we're unleashing connections that profit with purpose.
Harlan, welcome to the podcast. Welcome to the show. I am so thankful to have you on my show. You wanna give us just a little bit of your background? Sure. And thanks Michael. This I had you on my podcast, love talking to you, and I'm glad to be back on your podcast now. Been looking forward to this.
So my background is pretty varied. I grew up in Southern California. I worked at Lockheed Aircraft for a while, then went to college and when I came out I found a job as a consultant. And so for. Next 30 some odd years, I was a management consultant, organizational change and business transformation.
So working with companies that were undergoing some major time to change, like a merger acquisition, a process, re-engineering, a new software implementation, something like that. Anything that touched the people processes or technology in the business is a change. And if you're not careful how you manage that change, you could lose some employees, some key employees along the way.
So our job was to get with the executive team to help them understand the impacts. The change would have and could potentially have on their business, help them communicate that change and lead their people through the change. So they were as productive after, as they were before. That was our goal.
But that meant getting on an airplane every Monday and every Friday, flying to a client side, flying home on the weekends. And it got to be a little bit much. So after about what, however long, 25, 30 years, I told my wife, I think I wanna stop traveling for a little while. So I started networking locally and, business coaching for some of the local businesses. So I've worked a lot with a lot of different varied businesses, and right now I'm working with commercial and residential contractors to help them improve their cash flow and maximize their profits, so their business can thrive and they get to take home as much of the hard earned money that they make.
So that's what I've been doing last eight, nine years. Wow. That sounds great. That sounds jam packed, that your background is so varied with so many different businesses. You probably have a lot to offer them, so hopefully that will just continue. But now let's get into just the networking and leadership.
You talk a lot about courage. What role does courage play in reaching out and building authentic business relationships? I think courage is huge. I wasn't used to networking and I got involved, like I said, when I came in off the road, went to a few different networking groups. And what I loved was realizing that a lot of these people are just like I am.
A lot of 'em were starting their businesses starting off. So they were a little nervous speaking up in front of people and getting up in front of people and talking. To get that courage to step onto a stage and talk even if it's about yourself, even if it's a topic you really know well, can be daunting for some people.
So getting that courage to, to get up and share. And the thing I learned about networking Bob Berg has a great book. The Go Giver. Don't go into a networking environment. Wanting to take, wanting to get referrals. Go in with a giving heart, right? Give referrals, recommend people, refer people, and that reciprocity will kick in.
And that's what I started finding out is the more that I helped other people achieve their goals, the more they were willing to help me achieve mine. And I think networking is key to any business. If you're in business and you're not networking, you're missing a big opportunity. Absolutely. And that's one of my biggest points when I coach and when I go on the road to talk about networking, is you give with what's called a servant's heart, you always give before you receive and it will definitely come around to you.
Have you ever made a connection that completely changed the trajectory of your business or leadership path?
I've made a lot of amazing connections. I'll tell you, I, I actually met with this guy this morning. We just happened to bump into each other at a networking event, and he is a business coach like I am. So you'd think we're in a competing area that there'd be some animosity between us. This is one of the most giving men I've ever met.
Jeff Bartholomew. He helps. Anybody that asks him for help. So I'll bounce ideas off of him. He'll give me some direction, from either problems or things that happened to him in his past. Say, Hey, watch out for this. Watch out for that. And he is really helped me as I go and approach these different new businesses.
Sometimes you come into a new business, I. I'm not familiar with every business in the world. I know the business of business, right? So I can help people with their strategies, their systems cashflow, things like that. But the finer details of the business, sometimes those elude me. So I can go with Jeff, we'll sit down and have a cup of coffee, bounce ideas off of each other and stuff, and I come out, recharge, ready to go.
So yeah, the networking, he has been a great mentor for me. That's great that you can find somebody in your same lane and you're not in competition, but you actually help one another. And I think that's the true meaning of doing business and networking and having the servant's heart. So that's right on all the levels.
In your experience, how can networking directly impact a small business' cash flow for better or worse? One thing I try to get my clients to understand is networking. You never know who you're talking to and how they're connected. So getting out in opportunities to talk to people, to let them know what it is that you do and how you do it, I think is great for business.
The one thing that happens a lot with with cashflow it's not so much the money coming in, it's the things that are going on in the business. How they use the money that's going out, the profitability. By getting out and networking with people, you can run into what we call gate openers.
The people who may not ever buy the product or service you're selling, but they work with the same. Clients or customers that you do, and they may be able to bring you in when the client buys this. Maybe your product or service is the next little piece they're missing. And so these gate openers can actually introduce you to people and anytime you can get an introduction to someone, it carries so much weight that halo effect.
If they've already bought from this person they're in good standing, right? People, and trust that halo effect shines on you and when they introduce you, you've got their credibility standing in for you and stuff. So I think networking is huge and it's, I've seen it change people's lives where they will make a connection that connects 'em with the second or third party who then becomes a big customer for them.
So you just never know where it's gonna go. So you're not networking necessarily with the person you're speaking to, you're networking with their network Yeah. Of people. Exactly. And whether it's two or three times removed because if they've purchased from you or from somebody that is associated with you.
They like you already. They all, that trust factor is already there so they can recommend you. That's very true and I always believe in talking to the person as if they're the center of their network, so that's very good. Do you believe referrals are the most underutilized revenue stream in a small business?
Absolutely. Absolutely. A lot of the mindset is, we've sold something to these people. They've done their part. I've done my part and we're done with them. I try to get my clients, keep involved, email them every once in a while, check in with them. If you're in the neighborhood, stop by and say hello.
If it's business to business or something like that, try to stay in front of them as much as possible. 'cause you never know when they're going to be talking to someone or someone in their family needs something and you wanna stay top of mind with them. If you sell and then you walk away, then you know better than some of the big box retail stores, they don't come and see how things are going. If you buy a product or, oh, I can, I can't hear. Okay. I can't hear. I'm sorry. Did, oh, now I can't hear you. Alright, are we back? Yeah, sorry. Sorry. I told you technical difficulties. If somebody buys a product or service from you, check in with them after a month or two.
See how that product is working. Did it do everything that you thought it would, did we perform the way we thought we could? Those type of interactions, I think grow. If people have a really good experience, they're gonna tell more their friends and colleagues about what you do. So always keep those relationships forefront.
I, I truly believe that the days of building your customer list is really passe. Now you're building the relationships and after you have your you've given them a service, whatever the case may be, you put 'em into your CRM and do some sort of a drip campaign, so you're always staying top of mind.
So they always say, oh, you know what? Harlan knows that. Let me give him a call. He just gives you a call. She gives you a call. I'm a firm believer in the relationship building as opposed to just adding to your client list your customer list. You often say small business owners face one major problem.
How can the right network help solve it?
I often quote Mike Mitz, a business author profit First. Fix This Next. Mike Mitz said, the biggest problem business owners have is that they don't know what their biggest problem is. And I found that true with the, some of the clients that I've worked with they know something's wrong. The business isn't quite working the way they thought it should, but they have no idea what they do.
So they end up working longer, working harder, trying to get more sales, right? And that's rarely the problem that's happening. By going out and networking, talking to other people, talking to them about their businesses, see the struggles that they're going through. You may realize, Hey, I'm barking up the wrong three.
That's not really what's going on. Find out what they're using. If you're looking to change your point of sale system, what are other people using? Network with them and ask the questions. People are love to talk about themselves. They love to talk about their business. Go up and ask somebody, why do you guys do this?
And again, you're, yes, you may be in a similar industry, you may be competitors. There are what, seven, 8 billion people in the world. There are plenty of people, there are plenty of customers around there. Don't get hung up on that. Talk to people, ask them about their business, share some ideas trade with them.
And yeah, I think you can really find out, how to improve that. 'cause everybody needs a little help along the way. And picking up a tidbit from this.
You froze. Froze. Okay. Okay. Yeah I firmly believe that if you ask somebody for their point of view, not necessarily their help. Their point of view. Tell have them tell about themselves, in their work environment or so people, as you said, people love to talk about themselves. They love, but they love to give you advice.
You feel that you've made it when somebody asks you for your advice. So it puts them up and it puts you on a higher pedestal when you ask, because it shows that you are truly interested. Okay. So here's a good one, right? What's the biggest mistake entrepreneurs make when trying to build their network?
I, so I think one thing is going in again with that mindset that I'm here to get, rather than them here to give. They burst into a little cluster of people talking and start talking about themselves and what they do and handing out business cards and everything. And I think you put people off and they're not gonna think about you.
They're not gonna refer to you if they get a client. If you come in. Listen, ease yourself into a conversation and then ask some pointed questions about the people that are already in there talking. Even if you turn around and walk away from the group, you're gonna be one of the most interesting people they've met that day.
Because you took the time to listen and ask them about their business. So make your networking about getting with other people and asking them about their business, make it about helping them or referring people to them and your business will grow a absolutely. You hit the nail right on the head.
You, everything that I go out and I speak about and everything else and what you have to do. You said it really so eloquently, but you. Really just got to the base of what I would say would be a huge mistake of anybody trying to network is going and talking. That they should listen and it should be active listening.
Not just listening to hear, but listening to listen and respond to them with what they're saying. So yes, listening and all that with you. Giving out the business cards is a major no-no. Off the bat. I'll tell you a funny story. I was at a networking event and it was about five of us at a table.
And a guy comes walking up, Hey, how you doing? What's going on? Hey, I know all of you here. Wait a second. Here, take my card. Zip zip. Listen, I want to get in touch with all of you. You all have my contact information. Can I have your cards because I want to. And he was off. Yeah. And we looked around what just happened?
Yeah. We all just took his car and threw it out. That's the number one way of not doing it. That's the way of not doing it. And be engaged. And be engaged. I had a one-to-one meeting with a guy that I thought I would either be able to help him or help, some of his clients and friends.
He spent the entire meeting talking about himself me. And then his phone rang and he picked up his phone and talked on his phone for the next, and then our time was up. And it's I will never do business with somebody like that. Absolutely. I wanna know that if they're sitting with me I try to be as engaged as possible.
I put my phone away, put their face down. I try to look them in the eye, ask them questions, be engaged with what they're saying. He was all about me. And that just doesn't work. Yeah, no, absolutely. Absolutely. You, that's not going you with the servant's heart. That's not going in to to give rather than receive.
So yeah I can I understand that wholeheartedly. Okay, so how do you personally decide which relationships to invest in and which to let go?
As far as to invest in, I'm always looking for the people who work with the same type of clients I work with. Either a peripheral type service or product that, that I can then go in and help. On top of that, I'm looking for those people to make connections with. Other people I want to get to know because who knows, something will come up and maybe I'll be able to refer somebody to them, but if I.
Put a call into them or put an email into them and they don't respond to me. If I send a referral to them and they don't respond to that referral, I'm done because it's my reputation too. Absolutely. That's on the line. When I send a referral to you, I've already cleared with this person that they are looking for your product and service.
If I say, Hey, I've got somebody I network with, the guy's great, blah, blah, blah. I turn them over to you. If you drop the vault, I look bad, and now it's hard for me to go back in front of that person and give any referral. So that's one of the big things that, that, I look for if somebody doesn't respect the referrals I'm giving them, if they don't respect my time and my effort, sorry, I just won't do business with them.
Respect goes such a long way, and you have to know how to respect. The other person, and as you said, you take your phone, you put it in your pocket or face down, it's away from you. You don't even consider looking at it. You're looking at the person square in the eye. You're engaging with the person, so you're a hundred percent present.
And if they can't give you the same respect, then you really don't have a relationship at all. You've told me how successful you've become. But why don't you give me a mistake that you've made personally and how you overcame it? So I was in the first networking group that I went to. I was that guy that wanted to talk about myself and how great I am and everything that I know and everything I've experienced, and.
I, it was one of the mentors from the group that kind of came over and put his arm around me and said, let's take a walk. And he introduced me to, the servant's heart. And I had no idea I was there to promote me. And that just didn't work. And I, it was tough kind of getting back in with that group and building that rapport that I shouldn't have done in the first place.
Getting to know them and asking about them that took a while to build that back up. Now, that's when I go in. That's my first thought is be quiet, listen, ask questions, but just be there and just soak it all in. And then if somebody turns and says, Hey, tell me about you. Okay if they've told me enough about themselves, fine, I can talk then.
But I try to wait. And when I say, ah, you're far more interesting than I am, I'd love to know more about blank. And get them to start talking again. But yeah, I was a guy that dropped the ball that first time I just came in. I had flyers, I had business cards, I had all kinds of stuff that I wanted to pass out to every single person in the room.
It's not the way to do it, and it's not easy to do, is it? It's not easy just to turn that around because you grew up you always thought you're here to sell something, your services or whatever the case may be, and you want to tell everybody what you have. That's why you're there.
But it's a whole different mindset. A whole mindset. And it's not easy to do. It's not something you can do overnight. It's something you have to practice. Because listen, networking is a skill. Yes. And it's a talent. So you have to practice practice. Yeah. That's, and the networking group, sorry.
The networking group that I'm involved in right now, they're very good about one of their hard and fast rules is do not sell to anyone in this group. If you're not here to sell to these people, nobody gets up that early in the morning to be sold to tell them how they can help you. How can you know, here's who I helped, how I helped them, and a great referral for me would be X.
And here's a good opening question because that's one of the hardest things. I don't know exactly how to refer this person to a. A marriage counselor. I don't, how do you breach that, right? How do you say, Hey, I've got a marriage counselor, I'd love you. It sets people off, right? So they're teaching us how to give the, what they call a kindling question, just to get the fire going a little bit, something thought provoking.
You can ask them, Hey, if you ever considered this, or how is this going? Or, Hey, I just read this article, have you ever had that same issue? Just something little like that. If they say, yeah, you know what, I'm dealing with that right now. I may have somebody you can talk to, so trying to get that down, it's, again, it's not, you're not selling to the people you're networking with.
You're built, basically building your sales team. These are the people that are gonna go out and think of you, so whatever you can do to help them keep you in their mind that's what you ought to do. And that's really the perfect way, you can't, I used to belong to A BNI and that was referral.
Whether it was a real referral or not, and most of the time, name in your pocket. Yeah. It was not okay. I did one year of BNI because that's what I paid for and I really cut it out when I was in New York. I had my own networking groups. One in New York, one New Jersey. I had about 30 businesses in each.
I took the best from BNI, the best from the tip, and I created my own networking group. And I did just about what we're talking about now. But it's been years and years of practice, because nobody would get it right first time out. Sure. When building a network from scratch, what's the first thing a small business owner should do?
I think the pre-work understanding, number one, your products and services that you're gonna talk about, understand who your customer is. So you have a good, clear picture of who that customer and how you can help them. What are the things they're struggling with? How does your product or service ease that pain or solve that issue that they have so that you know then how to go out and present your business to everybody.
I think the other thing is then those peripheral people who offer similar services or complimentary services, adjacent services, if you will, that they may be talking to some of the same customers that you are. For a long time I was working with an investment person and a counselor, and I would bring in things about when you're getting ready to sell your business, some of the struggles you go through with the family business, how that impacts the family and things.
We work with a lot of the same people, so we saw that there might've been a little bit of overlap, so we did a few presentations together. That was good. If you could. Find out who those other people are that those gate openers and try to, who would these people be?
And then reach out to them. If they're not in your group, invite somebody to be in your group. Tell everybody else I would love an in introduction to this person or this person, to try to get them in your group. Always try to build your group. Think about who you know that could support somebody else in your group, and start inviting them.
That's very good advice. And actually that was the way that I built up my groups to be so large. When I was doing the networking groups, I was in the mortgage industry, so I obviously invited real estate, financial insurance, because we talk to the same people in different. Parts. So we all helped one another, but the two groups grew to be quite large and I had to leave them to come down to Georgia, but I, that's what I did.
Has there ever been a time where networking saved your business or your sanity? Sanity, definitely. It, every business goes through ups and downs, right? You're on the rollercoaster. And a lot of times you think, is it something that I'm doing? Is it something that I'm not doing or I'm doing wrong?
By being in the network and sharing that, here's a concern that I have and stuff, you realize that a lot of people are going through the same thing you are. Maybe you can help support each other, through that. And I did that when I first, got into to coaching there were a lot of times where I'd hit drop spells.
It's I, what am I doing wrong? And everybody said no. Everybody's slow right now. Covid is a great example for a lot of businesses that impacted people. And it's like just. We'll get through this, and maybe here's some options you could do. Here's some things you might be able to do instead of going personally into these different offices.
Can you offer online courses? Can you offer any online meetings and things like that. So try to help each other through those tough times. That's, I've made some friends in the networking groups I've been in that we're still friends and we probably will be for life. And we do try to help each other whenever we can.
So I think that's a big part of it. H how can you balance the in-person networking groups or in-person networking events with digital?
And I think there are a lot of both now. People are used to using Zoom and Teams to conduct work. So I don't think they're as. Standoffish as they, they were for a while. Everybody, if you're not meeting in person, it's not valuable. I don't agree. I have a group of other business coaches that I meet with every other month and scattered all over, but we get together and share online and it's nice to build that rapport.
I think you can do it, you have to be a little bit more specific on how you build those long distance. Relationships, be intentional about it. Be engaged. You don't wanna be on camera and be looking off to the side doing something or playing with your dog or whatever. You wanna make sure that you're engaged just like you are in a meeting sitting with people.
Have your camera on. I've been in a few meetings where people have their camera off. That's almost like being in a conference room. You turn your chair around to face the window and not look at the people you're meeting with, have your camera on and be engaged and ask questions and things like that.
So it's all the same rules that would apply in a live event. But having those zoom type meetings I think are great because you can get yourself involved in other areas where you might not be able to drive to all the time. Get involved in the, those meetings and you can still meet with these people, still get in front of them and find out what they're doing and how you can help them and they in turn can help you.
So yeah, I think it's a, I think it's a great tool. I love the online meetings. Yeah it's great. I do virtual workshops, which was new to me because I'm used to going to the business and doing a workshop and everything, but I always give them a. Standard rules, a list of standard rules.
Have your camera on, be attentive, be interactive. Don't look down at your phone. Don't you know, Mick believe that you're in a conference room? And I would say 90% of the time it works. Because that other 10% of time yeah, nothing works. Okay, let's bring this, let's bring this full circle.
Okay. What's one networking habit or ritual you swear by that our listeners could start doing today?
In the networking group that I'm in right now, we write down the one best thing that we, how you go around the table and introduce yourself. Here's my business, who's who I work with, and what I do, and how I help them. We write down the one best thing we learn from each person. And then towards the end of the meeting we can stand up and say, Hey, I really liked how you said this.
I really love the quote you gave on this. And it gives some support and feedback pat on the back, which everybody needs, right? Just some encouragement to keep doing what you're doing. We can also jot down. Maybe tips, Hey, you missed an opportunity to say this or talk about this. We share those opportunities then with the person afterwards.
So again we're there to help support each other and build each other up, not just to get referrals from you, but to build that the morale of the whole team. And so yeah, that's what I like to do. I take a lot of notes during the meeting and I share those with everybody during the meeting and after.
That's great. And that's, and I'm sure that's taken practice. You didn't just, get out of college and all of a sudden start doing all these fantastic things you had to learn. And that's what I'm trying to get at with my listeners that first of all, you go out and you start, you just do it, 'cause the first time you're gonna suck, there's no two ways about it. You're not gonna get, but by the second, third, fourth, fifth. Fifth time, you're gonna get better and you're going to enjoy it. And the last thing is, I'm sure that whenever you go to a networking event, you have a good time, right?
You enjoy yourself because nobody likes going out and working without them getting any type of. Feedback or anything else like that. So that's it. So Harlan, I want to tell you, this was fantastic. You were a great guest and if somebody wanted to get hold of you for coaching for otherwise, how can they do it?
They can start on my website. The website is IB four e coaching.com. A lot of information out there. We've got some PDFs and things like that you can download from there. Free content. And yeah, if they'd like to talk to me, you can connect with me there. Connect would be on LinkedIn, Harlan Hammock on LinkedIn and love to chat.
Love to talk with you. Fantastic. Harlan. I can't wait to speak with you again. I'll speak with you soon. Awesome. Thanks Michael.
Well, hold on folks. Don't go anywhere. Lemme just read a few of our sponsors that we have. Struggling to read success. Maybe. Time to quit in Quit Your Way to Success by Rodney Davis. This reveals 27 steps to Breaking Bad Habits that hold you back. This powerful book helps you rewire your mindset, take control of your actions, and turn setbacks into stepping stones with real life examples.
Motivational quotes and actionable lessons, especially for sales professional, you'll gain the tools to quit what's stopping you and start winning. Transform your future today. So quit Your Way to Success by Rodney Davis. Available now on Amazon. And this is a nonprofit called Revved Up Kids. This is something I believe in Wholeheartedly Revved Up Kids is on a mission to protect children and teens from sexual abuse, exploitation, and trafficking.
They provide prevention, training programs for children, teens, and adults. To learn more, go to rev up kids.org. That's R-E-V-V-E-D-U-P-K-I-D-S. Dot org.
Michael is a business networking expert specializing in enhancing professionals' networking and communication skills to drive profitability. As a leading authority in this field, he is highly sought after for his dynamic presentations and workshops. His extensive experience has consistently led to significant improvements in corporate profitability by empowering individuals and organizations to connect more effectively and efficiently.
Digital Courses
Comments