Networking Unleashed: Building Profitable Connections. An Interview with Jermane Cheathem and Michael A Forman

  Welcome back to Networking Unleashed, building Profitable Connections, the podcast where we strip away the fluff and get real about networking fuels your business and your life. Today's episode is going to challenge the way you think about success. My guest believes that the four hour workday isn't some dream.

It's the standard we should all be aiming for. His philosophy flips the script on the old hustle mentality. The goal of business isn't a maximum growth at all costs. It's a minimalist freedom. Building the life you want on your terms. And here's the kicker. Networking is the key to making that freedom possible, not by piling on more contacts, events, or obligations, but by creating the right intentional relationships that multiply your time and your results.

So buckle up Buttercup, because we're about to dive into how you can design a network that buys back your hours, boosts your profits, and gives you the freedom and you. Gives you the freedom you've been chasing. So let's get started. That was a bit of a mouthful for me, but I think I got it. I'd like to welcome to the podcast Jermaine Cheatham.

And I would like to ask you, first of all, welcome to the podcast and could you give us a little bit about your background and how you got here today? Hey Michael. Thanks man. I appreciate you having me. I'm glad to be here. My background is, since I was young, since I was 5, 6, 7, I always wanted freedom and that's financial freedom, that's time freedom, that's location freedom.

I just wanted freedom in life in general and. I didn't know how to get it until I ran into business and sales, and that was the quickest, most fastest, most efficient way for me to obtain all those freedoms is through sales and entrepreneurship. And to speak to your audience is the best way to excel in sales and entrepreneurship is not trying to reinvent the wheel, it's simply to connect with other people.

AKA networking that already have your ideal client in their network and have their trust. And that is the ultimate leverage. And so that's, that one idea created all the freedom I ever wanted in my life and in my business. Wow. That's great. That's great. So you, when did you obtain that freedom? I subjective, financial freedom is a different number for everybody.

Time freedom is a different number for everybody. I didn't really gain this freedom until I made the leap from employee. To entrepreneur because then I started to own my time. I started to own all my income and I had autonomy of my life. So that was back in 2016 when I made that leap from the corporate business structure working for somebody else to, I'm doing this on my own.

Probably scary also making that jump. For sure. But it's not as scary as being a slave to the day you die. Yeah that's so true. Listen, I was, I'm a former business owner myself. I had pizzerias restaurants Ben and Jerry's. I had it all. I was in New York and the fast paced, I was all into the fast paced.

I moved down here to Georgia and it slowed down. And I got into my own thing without the storefront. But that's a story for another day. Most people think networking is about adding more and more connections, more events, and more time spent. How does a minimalist approach to networking look different?

And why might it actually be more effective? From a minimalist lens, only thing you're looking for is leverage. You're looking to put in a little bit and get a lot out, and so when you're thinking about leverage from a business context, you want to make sure whatever you're selling your product or service is highly lucrative.

And so what I decided to do is. Get into probably the most lucrative space you can find, and that's financial services. Because it's an evergreen need for businesses. They always need this thing, and it's something that doesn't ever go out of style regardless of what's going on in the economy. It's always in demand.

That's one aspect of it is picking the right actual product or service to sell. That's number one. And then from that lens, once you find something that's highly leverageable and lucrative, then you figure out I don't need a hundred contacts. Because if I have a hundred contacts sending me business or deals.

I have to manage those people. I have to manage their protocols and their procedures and their personalities versus let me find 10 that actually give me, the same amount of, say, income that the a hundred would give me without all the headache of dealing with 10 x, the amount of people, personalities, and procedures.

So it's really about finding the right product or service. With the right key strategic partners that have your ideal customer in their space and in their sphere of influence. And then leverage that relationship because the psychology of trust is always at play. If I. Friends with Roger, and Roger knows the client that I ultimately want to be in touch with.

Roger's gonna put me in touch with that client and that client's gonna trust Roger. Therefore they're gonna trust me. It's just how psychology works. This isn't rocket science. And so when you have a lucrative product or service and you have this type of flywheel where people are bringing you into the deals that are pre-selling these deals for you.

The clients just sign. They don't ask any questions. There's no back and forth. There's, it's just a seamless way to do business, and so that's where the leverage really lies, where you're not spending all day working on deals or prospecting. You let your strategic partners do all that work for you, and it's a win.

Your product or service has to make sure it helps your. Your referring partner win, like it helps him sell whatever he's selling and it also helps their client. So you have to make sure everyone's rowing in the right, same direction, and then like business becomes simple, easy, and fun. I understand all of that.

So you had to work your way through the cloud of just hit and miss clients to get to your 10, let's say, of those clients that will refer you, that will pay more attention to you. But how did you get through that cloud that, fact of you having to meet. A hundred people to get to the 10. Yeah, so the easiest way I went about doing this is number one, I checked on who was already in my network, who do I already know in my Rolodex, in my phone?

And so I started to strategically start reaching out to people who already knew in the business, my business world, and saying, Hey, do you know X? Do you know people work in X? And I wanted to get into the healthcare space. I wanted to get into the medical space. So I literally started just reaching out to people I knew.

In the business world and hey, do you know people in the healthcare space? I'd like to meet with you and see if I can get into that that arena. And so I met with a lady, she was a friend of mine, she was a marketing person here in Arizona. We had coffee and she's yeah, call Roger. And then I talked to Roger, and obviously it was a warm introduction, this is the, this is networking one-on-one, just talking to people.

That's it. We're not selling anything. And so I talked to Roger and he tells me, Hey, we're having an event. I go to the event. And I meet all these people that are in the medical space that sell medical software, medical equipment, and all of their clients actually needed my financial services to help him and her sell their equipment and software to the doctors.

And so my point is this is you're just looking for a couple of contexts to leverage because. Once you get in with one of the contacts, they have buddies, they have other sales reps are at the same organizations that now bring you into the fold because again, the psychology of trust, if Roger uses Jermaine, then Tim will feel comfortable using Jermaine and so will Sarah.

And then next thing I'm doing the financing for the entire organization. And so that's a simple way of how I thought about let me just try to knock over the lead domino, and usually that's just one person and that was the lady that I met with in marketing that was already in my phone.

That sounds. Strangely equivalent to what I go through as a speaker and as a coach and a trainer. I go for that keynote, that workshop. When I get into the company, other people find out about what I am speaking about and they tell friends and so on. So it sounds eerily close to the same type of thing.

Okay, you advocate the four hour workday as a standard. What role does networking play in creating that freedom, and how can we avoid letting networking itself become another time drain? I have one key thing about business. If you're working more than four hours a day, you are working on the wrong thing, period.

You're not finding the leverage, and maybe that is what you're selling. Maybe that is who you're selling it to, and maybe that's how you're doing it. From a networking lens, what you need to think about is you don't wanna be the expert in anything, because if you are the expert in anything, that means you have to actually deliver the service or goods.

You have to actually do the work. I'm an advocate of being just a connector, a middleman, a person that sits in the middle of the person that needs the thing, and the person that sells the thing, and I bring you together. I don't do any work and I get paid for the connection. And so when you think about networking from that lens, you have to pick the right product or service you want to connect people with, and the right customer you want to connect them with.

'cause they gotta have money, they gotta be in pain. They have to be able to afford your thing that you're connecting 'em with. And same thing with the service. It has to be a lucrative service that is evergreen. So when you think about it from that lens, of course you're not working more than a few hours a day because you're.

You're basically trying to be a surgeon with a scalpel versus just throw stuff against the wall and see if it sticks. So it's about picking the right service and finding the right people that need that service. And then your obviously flywheel is gonna be, the connectors all need this to make their business work.

And you're not doing the work, you're not delivering it, you're not doing any of the client work. You're just connecting people, wiping your hands and everyone's happy. That sounds, I used to be a print broker and I used to have clients that needed printing. I developed a relationship with printers and it flowed through me, but I didn't have to do anything, but I was getting paid.

So it's like the same thing. Okay, so many entrepreneurs chase maximum growth, which often means constant expansion or context and commitments. How does networking shift when the goal is freedom instead of scale? If you wanna scale and you wanna have a billion dollar company, you're gonna be working 16 hour days.

That's just the reality of it. And so at what point are you gonna be. Satisfied at what point is enough? Enough. And so I realized in my early twenties when I started making for me, very good money, 20, $30,000 a month, I realized I can't spend all this. What am I what am I buying?

What do I really need that's gonna fulfill me? And you try, you experiment, you buy stuff and you realize that wasn't it. And so over time you realize like life is not a, a. About making more money and just working all day. Life for me is about personal fulfillment, and a lot of that means getting my time back.

I like to work, but I don't wanna work all day because there's so much more to explore in life. I love to exercise. I love to go on hikes. I love to go on vacation. I love to travel. I love to read. I love to explore. And i'm okay working from eight till noon, but after that I wanna do other stuff. And so like for me, I'm not looking for maximal scale.

I'm looking for maximal personal fulfillment. And from a networking lens, that's where. I realized when I was doing financial services, I was like, okay, I have a very lucrative thing here. I don't need to do a hundred deals a month to, to make a very good income. I could do a handful, which will take a few hours, and obviously I'll have some prospecting and stuff and staying in touch with my clients, but it's not, it's a few hours a day.

And so when I realized this thing is very valuable, and I found out okay, these guys that have the ultrasound equipment or the MRIs equipment, or any of the medical devices they need, my. My, my lending services to help their doctors get their devices. Plus it's a tax benefit for the doctors 'cause it's a hundred percent tax deductible.

The banks and the underwriters, they wanna lend out the money. So all I was simply doing is staying in the middle. I'm not the expert. The banks are the experts. The medical device sales guys, they're the experts in the equipment. The doctors are the expert in ophthalmology or whatever it is, right? So I'm simply just bringing the bank that wants to lend out money.

The doctor that needs the money to buy the equipment seller that needs. To sell the equipment all together. I wipe my hands in a few hours a day, then I can go to the gym, go on a walk, go on vacation, do this from anywhere 'cause it's a digital business. It's about leverage again, the right product, selling to the right person the right way through strategic partners.

Wow, that's good. Okay, so what are some signs that someone is over networking? Collecting contacts, but losing focus, and how can they reverse that into meaningful minimalist connections? Okay, so number one is if you're talking to people, if you're chasing anybody, that's a number one sign. Never chasing anybody.

You'll know after the first encounter, if this person is real, if it makes sense. If it feels right, you're gonna have instant feedback that this is a real thing. That's number one. Number two is. If you always have people trying to waste your time, let's get a coffee, let's do this, let you know what, sure, I'd love to have a coffee with you, but specifically, what do you do?

How do you do it, and how does it align with what I do? So we're both rowing in the same direction, but more importantly, we're both getting paid. Sufficiently because life is short. We all die. I want to make money on my connections and I wanna also help my connections make money too. It's a two-way street.

I want us both to get paid and if there, if I don't see a throughput where we can get paid, there's absolutely no reason for us to meet unless you know somebody that can help me get paid and help them get paid. And I'm happy to pay you a commission for making that. Happen. So I think a lot of it comes down to you have to be direct with people.

The director, you are the clearer and the more lucrative. The relationship's gonna be, if you notice, a lot of people will hem and haw and they're just happy and they're just, they wanna be friendly. And they're people pleasers. People pleasers are usually some of the worst entrepreneurs and salespeople.

So if you see a people pleaser or you get that kind of vibe run for the hills 'cause they're just gonna waste your time and they're not doing any business. People that are busy are doing stuff. So those are my two main things is, focus on ignoring people pleasers and staying focused on who's really gonna be able to send you business.

Okay, sure. And those salesy type people, the people who really aren't doing business, they're going to your networking events more for social reasons rather than making money. And if you're top priority, I have a slightly different take on a networking event. I go with what's called a servant's heart.

I see what I can do for them, not what they can do for me. So I'm not looking for a sale, I'm not looking how I can strategically align with them. I'm just looking to put two people together and I walk away. I have them because in turn they look at me, they say look, Mike gave me a referral, so I'm gonna have to give him one.

And so it's a slightly different take on what you are saying, but it's along the same lines. Okay. In your view, what's the biggest myth about networking that keeps business owners stuck in long hours and unnecessary busyness?

I think that they need to talk to everybody. You don't need to talk to anybody except for your ideal avatar or ideal customer. And in order to know who your ideal customer is, or client or. Partner is, you need to know where the leverage is based on whatever you're selling. I, it's surprising sometimes you'll talk to people and you don't even think that they know what they even offer 'cause they're not even quite sure about it.

They're not even crystal clear about like where's their value and their proposition. And so the clear you are and exactly what you sell, then you can get laser focused on finding those type of partners that have you. Your ideal client already in their network and their influence. And so those are the only people you focus on.

Like for me, in my financial services, I only focus on medical device salespeople. That is it. So any event, any person I talk to that is the specific type of person I wanna talk to, and that's it. Because they can bring me deal after deal that are pre-sold and pre-loss. Don't talk to everybody.

Talk to the person. That is your key ideal avatar. Exactly right. That's exactly right. Okay. How do you personally decide which relationships to invest in deeply and which to let go without feeling like you're missing out on opportunities? This kind of is what we just talked about, but not really. Number one is, I'm a capitalist, so if it's a lucrative relationship and I like the person, then that's where I'm gonna invest all my time and effort in.

If it's a lucrative relationship and I don't really like the person, I'm gonna try to mitigate my. Personal contact with that person and make it more transactional. And so I'm not really gonna invest as heavily if we're just not seeing eye to eye on whatever it might be. And typically, 90% of all the relationships you actually have that are really good and really long lasting.

They're lucrative and you like the person. And usually the ones that, those 10% where you really don't like the person, but it is lucrative, they typically fizzle out sooner or later. 'cause they're gonna find someone they actually do vibe with. And that's okay. But you, but before you write someone off, here's one thing I always try to do is give the person a chance.

Really try to connect with them, really have a conversation with them. Ask 'em about their family, what they're up to, and try to connect with them on a human level. And for whatever reason, if it still doesn't work, then say Lavie. It is what it is. But you have to at least give people an opportunity, because I believe in every human, there's a good heart there.

It's just sometimes, maybe it's a worldview or who knows what. It might be a personality clash. I don't know. And sometimes you just don't see eye to eye but you have to give it an opportunity. Good. Absolutely right. If someone only had four hours a day to run their business, what specific networking strategies would you tell them to focus on for maximum leverage?

It depends on what they sell. I'm assuming it's gonna be something lucrative. So if it's very lucrative, the only thing I'm gonna find is. Where is that client located? Who, who's the client? Who's this ideal client that would buy this thing or utilize this thing? And then I'm gonna find out, okay, who already has this person in their network?

So for example, for mine it was medical device. People had all the doctors that I wanted to offer my financial services to buy their equipment, right? But here's an kind of an abstract idea. What if I sold weight loss services? Or fitness services, how do I find the person that wants to lose weight?

How do I find the person that wants to get in shape? I have no idea. That's, you can't even tell. You would have no idea who wants to do that. But you can make inferences based on psychology. Who would have people that might want to get in shape, might want to get stronger and look better physically?

Probably like high-end corporate dating coaches because all their CEOs that are maybe freshly off of a divorce or they're now back in the dating market, they're gonna wanna look. Their best, feel their best. Lose 10 pounds, put on 10 pounds of muscle. So I would just go to the corporate dating coaches instead of trying to find this needle in a haystack and say, Hey, corporate dating coach, let me offer all your clients 60 days of free training online.

And then at the end of the 60 days, they can decide if they wanna sign up for my package. This is the way, it's a win for all three parties. So that's what I would spend my four hours a day on is finding corporate dating coaches, or in my case, finding medical device salespeople to talk to or whatever you're doing.

Find the leverage, not you never sell to the customer directly. You find the people that have their customer in their network, and then you leverage that psychology of trust. Good. Very good. You've said the goal of business is freedom, not growth. How do you build a network that actually supports your lifestyle goals instead of pulling you further away from them?

Again, it starts with the product you pick. So you don't wanna have to do a hundred deals a month. You wanna be able to do a couple. That's number one. Number two is you wanna make sure you align yourself that with partners and clients. That do not waste your time. They're not message you, messaging you all day long.

They're not emailing you all day long. They're not calling you all day long. You want low maintenance partnerships because the truth is the people that are making the most money that are the most successful, they're always low maintenance. For the most part. It's always the headaches are the. Quote unquote losers.

The brokes, the people that aren't selling anything, there's the people that are stressed out and they're gonna take it out on you. So it, it's always a litmus test. Is this person calling me three times in one day? Is this person emailing me four times with a bunch of question marks? Are they texting me?

Are they bothering me? Because again, that disrupts my peace. It disrupts my, my, my freedom, really. And I'm fine with a phone call and an email, but I'll get back to you in 24 hours. I'll dictate what our engagement will look like. And so you have to sometimes fire. Clients, even if they're a lucrative client, because they're causing you trouble and they're causing you problems on in your life.

And life's too short to deal with people you don't like and that are a pain. No I learned that a long time ago to fire clients and people who aren't used to that saying, what are you out of your mind, Mike? It's a lot easier just to fire them, find somebody else, and move on with your life. Okay.

Minimal minimalism. Often means cutting the clutter. What does clutter in networking look like and how can listeners do a clean sweep of their connections while keeping doors open? Here's the deal. You've, everyone's heard of the 80 20 rule, the Pato principle? I believe in the 95 5 principle you get.

Almost all of your outcomes from five people. It's just the way it works. And so I would look at my Rolodex and be like if this person isn't getting me in touch with money, like actual revenue, if, and I've been talking to this person for a year or whatever it is. Stop talking to them, quit following up with them because life is short and there's something called opportunity costs and they're big.

And so if you're wasting your time on these 95 people when you could be trying to find these five people, that's where all your energy and effort is and what you'll notice if you've been around the block enough, you've done enough deals, you'll start to notice the best relationships. The best partners, the best clients were the ones that were effortless.

It just happened naturally. There was no chasing, there wasn't all this. Let me stay in touch. Let me stay in touch. No, you actually stayed in touch because deals were coming in every week, every month. That's how you stayed in touch. You stayed in touch at dinner, at lunch, at happy hour, whatever. It was almost like an effortless relationship.

And so if you're, if you find yourself like scratching and clawing and trying. Let it go. It will never, it's like any relationship. I don't care if it's friendships, romantic, whatever. If you're trying too hard, it isn't meant to be, and you're losing the opportunity cost to find something that will work out without any effort and it's enjoyable.

Very good. Okay, so let's bring this podcast full circle and look a little bit into the future. If you had to give one piece of advice to someone who's currently overwhelmed by both their work hours and their networking efforts, what's the first most free step they should take today? The first thing I would examine is, what are you selling?

Like really, what are you selling? Because usually the time suck is either explaining what you're selling, doing demos on what you're saying, trying to convince people about what you're selling. If you reexamine exactly what you sell typically, and you pick a better vehicle to get you where you want to go, that will free up 80% of your time.

It's usually you're just chasing your tail trying to sell something that's hard to sell just because you've always sold it. That would be the one thing I would think about is reexamine what you're selling and find a better, more lucrative, more seamless, simple thing. Okay. Listen, Jermaine, this was great.

It really showed somebody where my listeners exactly how to, not exactly, but almost exactly how to trim their day down from. 16 to 14 to 10 to eight and hopefully at about four hours a day. I'm myself, I am not, I work at least 10 hours a day, on one thing or another. I have a few hands in, a few pots, so it's not just one business, but I understand what you're saying because I can't go on this forever.

I have to focus a little bit more. If somebody wanted to get hold of you either to learn about the system, your hours want to be coached by you, what's the best way that they can get hold of you? Yeah, they should go to my website. It's creators learn.com. Just like creators of the universe learn.com.

And I have a mini course on there where it goes over like how to rethink what you sell. Who you sell it to. And so I talk about these five characteristics of the ideal product or service and the four characteristics of your ideal client. And then once you figure out that, we can figure out, okay, where do you find your strategic partners to do all the selling for you?

What we talked about here. I also have a cool dream income lifestyle calculator. 'cause a lot of people think, oh, I need to have a million dollars a year to be, financially free. And you actually put pen the paper and actually have an Excel calculator that shows you. You can live like a king on half a million dollars a year, which is only 50 grand a month, which is not crazy.

Yeah, they can check that out at creators learn. I'm very active on LinkedIn as well, so looking forward to connecting with people. Okay, great. Jermaine, thank you so much for coming on the podcast and I look forward to speaking with you soon. Great. Thanks Michael.

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 Folks. A huge thank you to our guests for sharing such incredible insights today, and of course, a big shout out to you, our amazing listeners, for tuning in and spending your time with us. If you're interested in my digital courses being coached or having me come and talk to your company, just go to MichaelAForman.com and fill out the request form.

Remember, networking isn't about being perfect. It's about being present. So take what you've learned today, get out there and make some meaningful connections. If you've enjoyed this episode, please don't forget to subscribe. Leave us a review. Share it with someone who could use a little networking inspiration.

Let's keep the conversation going. You can find me on Apple, Spotify, Pandora, YouTube, or my website michaelaforman.com/podcast.

Michael is a business networking expert specializing in enhancing professionals' networking and communication skills to drive profitability. As a leading authority in this field, he is highly sought after for his dynamic presentations and workshops. His extensive experience has consistently led to significant improvements in corporate profitability by empowering individuals and organizations to connect more effectively and efficiently.

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