Networking Unleashed: Building Profitable Connections. An Interview with Jason Fishman and Michael A Forman

📍 Welcome to Networking Unleashed, building Profitable Connections, the show where real relationships create real business growth. I'm your host, Michael Forman. A lot of professionals approach networking, like a quick transaction, meet someone, exchange information, hope and opportunity appears, but the most consistent success. It doesn't come from chasing a deal. It comes building trust over time. My guest today believes the strongest businesses are built through relation are built through relationship first. Networking. We're talking about how meaningful partnerships form through consistency, why follow up matters more than first impression, and how your digital presence can start a conversation before you ever walk into the room and keep it going. After, long after you leave. If you want referrals that keep coming, partnerships that last, and connections that actually grow your business, you're in the right place. So let's get into it. I'd like to welcome Jason Fishman to my podcast. I am really anxious to hear what you have to say because you are right in line with the things that I love to talk about. Jason. Welcome to the podcast. How are you? And how'd you get here today? Michael, honored to be here. Thank you for having me on. I got here today by running a marketing agency. Coming from the advertising space, working with Fortune five hundreds, but now focused on growth stage companies have worked with over 900 of 'em, have found a niche. Marketing agencies really need to have a specialization for capital raising. I found that to be a common need working with companies at these stages. And we've been able to use digital marketing. Advertising content outreach to bring investors to network with investors and then have them convert on these deals. So the success there has really been something that I like to talk about and make available to any type of founder to be able to raise capital using these vehicles, with us, without us but just using these exemptions, I find there's not enough awareness of them as a whole. That's great. Like I said, I can't wait to start asking you questions because I'm very interested in what you have to say. You emphasize relationship first. Networking. Yes. What's the biggest difference between someone who networks for immediate opportunity and someone who networks for long-term growth? Sure. This is something I talk about regularly, Michael. I think we see it eye to eye where for me, referral partnerships, strategic relationships have been instrumental to the growth of our agency and those have not been transactional overnight discussions. Like you said, I didn't meet someone at an event and they sent us an introduction the next day. It's happened, but I find far more value from an organic relationship where maybe I meet someone at an event. Maybe it's over. LinkedIn could talk about how I've done that. Even just with simple messages. And over time we, we've built a real rapport. We get on the line, learn more about what each other do. If we are talking about collaborating it's a blank canvas and what we're building together. I could talk about how we've worked with groups like that in the past, but I wanna really get to know 'em. I want to know what they do on the weekends. What they do online who else in my network that they work with and get a better understanding of their needs, their value points. And then I wanna be of service to them. I want to be able to make introductions before I ever ask for anything. You hit on so many points that was so strategically necessary for a good relationship that I can probably do a podcast in each one of those points. Okay. But the relationship building is so important. I consider the the pandemic a line in the sand. Before the pandemic, things were really transactional. You didn't really have to do much, just go out there. But ever since the pandemic and people were shut in and now they're just starting to come out, it's more relational and you have to really build up that relationship. So before I go on and talk about this, I, like I said, for two hours, I can just stop right there. Why do short-term wins sometimes quietly damage future opportunities without people realizing it. Because there's a larger game, there's larger goals at stake in many of those scenarios. So in some cases, those short term wins could be building blocks. Our approach towards marketing is test optimize scale, but whoever we're doing this with, we they need to know we're testing that it is that crawl, walk, run type of evolution. If I'm pushing too hard for a sale, for an introduction from a referral partner, I may turn them off. I may do the necessary followups, but they think I'm too aggressive. I'm only interested in sales and business and the deals. My focus is aren't aligned with theirs. Where I really want to get a grasp of what is the bigger picture. Let me zoom out a little bit what's really possible with these other groups, with these other relationships and even just the. The essence of the relationship itself I found myself maybe 10 years ago realizing I didn't really know my strategic partners on an individual level. And by taking extra steps, by flying out to 'em by, maybe they're in the greater Los Angeles area where we're based California by driving out to 'em, having lunch, having dinner. It's actually a big ask in Los Angeles with all the traffic. You'd be surprised how many people are hesitant about driving. My keys are in my pocket at all times. I'm ready to hop out to 'em by taking 'em golfing, by going to a Dodger game. And if you're not a fan of the Dodgers, fill that in with whatever team that you'd like. I'm okay. Lifelong Dodger fan, but you get the idea. It's about them as well too. So where are they based? I've been to Astro Games in Houston, Dodger competitor, but hey, we're there. Let's go. Let's check it out. It was a great baseball game. I had a lot of fun, was cheering for people that I wouldn't share about here. But you get the idea. I wanna have actual experiences with these individuals, whether it's just, over the phone. But like you said, post COVID digital era, I think it stands out. To be in someone's warehouse or in their office or at their local coffee shop. Shake hands with them, look at 'em in the eyes. Really ask the right question. Spend extra time than you normally would in a call in a meeting. I find that goes much further than just getting a deal right out of the gate. I think that's what you're speaking to a bit, and that's definitely what's produced for me. You're, again, you're saying exactly what I teach. I go across the country and I go on stages. I talk about networking, communications. I do a lot of workshops and I, everything starts with the eye contact, with the handshake, with that one-to-one. You pick up the vibe in the room, you pick up the vibe of the person. You can't do that. Through Zoom. You have to be in the same, and what I do is that I teach my clients, when you walk into an office or walk into an event, don't talk business. That's the last thing you want to talk about. You wanna talk about everything else first. And you always say but I'm here to make money. You will. But that'll come secondary. You have to get the relationship out of the way. First. You have to build that trust, know you, like you, trust you. They'll do business with you, and that trust factor is so important that you have to get over that first. That's a very big hurdle. What behaviors in an initial conversation signal to someone? I can trust this person long term. I'm very big on trust. I'm very big on honesty. If someone shares additional details with me, if they're very transparent, if they're very open, even it's, even if it's to their disadvantage in the conversation, that definitely stands out. People. People, they're humans. There's gonna be mistakes. Business is not always an upward trajectory. I work on marketing campaigns. There's inherent obstacles. I work on capital raises. They're not all successful. And anyone who tells you otherwise is probably a salesman. They're probably overstating it if they're sharing with me some of their losses. If they're talking about how they improve a service, an offering, what they focus on when it's not delivering to the fullest level. That to me, shows a humbleness that. I latch onto and I feel like I could trust on the reverse. On the flip side, if I catch them saying different numbers, different information, I don't want to use the word lying, but if I notice there's inconsistencies, I'm saying that in a plural format. That's definitely something that I think people note and lose trust, and many times you can't gain that back. So whether you're looking at what you are saying or more importantly how you're assessing others as soon as that feeling's gone, I would recommend moving on versus trying to repair it. I say that because I do try to improve it. Oh, maybe they just said one thing that was off and it's hurt me over time that, that's a big deal for me. As long as someone's telling me the truth, we could work past it. But if I'm starting to have doubts around that, it casts a shadow. Furthermore the more I could see online about them in a positive way, the better Again. Graphic design mentality comes out, social proof, third party validation, as featured by on their site, on their landing pages and their emails and their landing page. If they're appearing on podcasts. If they're speaking at conferences regularly, it tells me, Hey. Someone's, it seems like a lot of people like this person and it may not be the sole piece of information that I form my trust around, but it's just naturally gonna have me believe in what they do to a greater extent. Doing what they say as well, which goes all the way down to did they show up on time? Did they tell me if they're running late? A few minutes. Sure. But if it's 15 minutes and every time I'm starting to question when they tell me a time whether it's gonna happen, I'm starting to question the same thing around a contract or a proposal or a deliverable or anything along those lines. Yeah, you always have to back up what you say. You have to do what you say. You have to be on time, be consistent, and all these things are re rather simple to do, but also it's very easy to check up on, right? You can check up on, you can go on mine, on my website, on Zoom, on my YouTube, on Apple, Spotify, whatever. And you can check me out. A hundred percent and it'll take you five minutes, whereas 10 years ago you wouldn't even think about doing that because it would take too much work. But it's too easy to check up on somebody. So yes you, it, you don't bother not telling the truth or stretching the truth. 'cause that's pretty much how they do it. Without you having to be checked up on. You can just make it a very short conversation if you don't get the right vibe, okay. Many people enjoy a good conversation, but never see business come from it. What bridges the gap between a pleasant interaction and a meaningful partnership? Sure. First of all, from my perspective, I enjoy all those conversations. I find, hey, if two outta 10 conversations that I have turn to business, it's going to cover the value, the cost for the other eight, and I can really have fun. I can really be myself, enjoy their company, learn from what they do, and I don't have to be focused on a deal or a partnership that'll produce future deals. And. I found with that type of approach, I end up getting far more of those individuals to move forward. I think it goes back to what you were saying about that authenticity and energy that you feel when you're speaking to somebody. Much tougher to do online in person. Definitely preferred for that. Removing the goalpost a little bit. Sometimes in the practice sessions you perform better and you're just being more real with the other side that I find from there I do want to have some type of idea of where I want the discussion to go whether it matures or not. If I'm talking to my sales team, it's okay. How are you connecting with prospects? How are you getting 'em on a discovery call? At the discovery call? Is it appropriate to ask 'em for a proposal? Whether, we're speaking to them as a partner or offering to them as a prospective client. Are we offering them a proposal? Are we getting on a proposal review call? Are we discussing on a different medium than a call? Are we getting to an agreement stage? Each stage has the next call to action built in. I would say for the partnerships, you don't wanna be too aggressive with it. You wanna be asking them what are the best next steps? That way they're directing you towards it. That may not apply in every single situation, but I could tell you if I hear it from them, it's more likely to happen. They're gonna remember what they say a lot more than what I say. If they're telling me their needs, if they're expressing their concerns, if they're telling me it's gonna be a while, if I'm asking, is there anything we could do sooner? And they're explaining to me why it seems to be more concrete. I want them to tell me they wanna work with me. I want them to tell me, send over an agreement, send over a referral partnership. Can you build that referral deck that, that strategic partner deck, maybe it's not, full contract, but we're putting out a piece of content together. Some low hanging fruit for me. This may be a good tool for listeners, viewers is content creation. I have my podcast I have over 230 episodes out there. Hey, I'd love to find a way to collaborate even on a piece of content. In fact, I have a podcast. Would love to have you on as a guest. For the right partners is very effective. It's something you're offering. You're gonna be able to promote them to your audience. Maybe they'll promote you to their audience. You're able to point to that link later and show people you're discussing this with what they're all about. It's a good thing across the board. Does it have to be a podcast? No, absolutely not. An article That could be a blog, a substack, and any. Number of the platforms to distribute on. Could be a social media post on LinkedIn. You're tagging them on something. There's a lot of ways to co-create content. I've read, I've done research of course, and they say that if you are in a conversation with somebody and you talk more than 30% of the conversation, you talk too much. The other person should talk 70% of the time because as you said so eloquently, they will remember more than what they said than what you said. And so it keeps you going. So you're right on the money with that, it's perfect. At 30% is tough at times. It, it is. Either way. You look at it, either keeping it down to 30% or some people getting it up to 30%, but 30% seems to be the number. You talk about trust, follow up, and consistency. What does consistency often matter more than charisma in professional relationships? It absolutely does. We've hired team members based on their interview process and how they were consistent about follow ups and how other, prospects were not. And what that says to us there, there's this chart that I reference a lot in workshops, and it's all about sales, consistency and follow ups. And it shows that most salespeople don't follow up more than once. And the percentage drops, you know how many of them follow up? Two times, three times, four times, five times. It's 90% that don't follow up more than seven times. Meanwhile, the majority of sales take place in between touchpoint seven and 12. This is referring one specific graph chart, but either way it points a picture. Very few buyers. I move forward on the first conversation, the first touch point with marketing a bit more on the second third, but it's really after five, seven, later times. So you got this adverse occurrence where salespeople, businesses. Those looking to form a partnership, what have you, are not following up enough. The consistency is not there. Meanwhile, the other side doesn't move forward to a later stage. Now, if consistency means, hey, you're following up daily or weekly or monthly or quarterly, that's gonna vary for every different dynamic. I've had strategic partners where they didn't send me a deal for over two years. After that we got many and large projects at that they were very productive, very lucrative for both sides. Especially the client. I say all sides of the table, all three. But if I had fallen off, and I, it's been a year, nothing's happened here. It's been a year and a half, I'm not hearing that much from them. That wouldn't have happened. So the frequency could vary but find a way to stay in contact with everyone that you speak to. It's difficult to do in this day and age where, volume of LinkedIn messages and emails and, full schedule of calls each day and go to conferences and digital events. It's hard, but you will stand out at least to a percentage of the people that you're reaching out to. You don't overdo it, but if someone's getting mad at you for an annual follow up. Is it really, you who's doing something wrong? Maybe it's half year, maybe it's quarterly. You wanna find the right duration, as I mentioned. But sometimes showing up can make you really have the spotlight compared to others that are looking to establish the same thing with the group you're going after. Absolutely. And I teach the very same thing I, the, my clients that I coach, the workshops that I do, except I, instead of seven and 12 touch points, I teach between eight and 12 touch points. Okay, there you go. And I like that consist consistency is the key. And I have what's called a secret sauce in follow up. And because the follow up is probably more important than actually meeting the person, right? So the consistency in the follow up and the timing of the follow up. You can't just send an email every week or two and hope for the best. There's a certain. Certain standard that you'd have to follow to see whether or not the person is interested. If you follow it, if you're consistent, if you have those eight to 12 touch points, then you're gonna get something done. If not, you put 'em into a drip campaign. You don't throw their contact information out, you put it into a drip campaign and you let it go. And do it. Try to do it that way. But again, you're right on the money. And it's amazing to me that some people don't, and I've asked why. I gonna run workshops and they'll say, ah, what if I bother them or are they more, likely not to respond if I keep following up. It's if they're not responding now, they're probably not going to later. Statistically, a few may reach out of nowhere. I got drawers full of business cards. Every now and then I pull one out and reach out to someone I forgot about, but that is the outlier. You wanna make it as easy as possible that for them to move forward and structure the language so that it is welcomed. It's not something that they get mad at. It's not just a How about now as much as adding value, pointing at content, telling 'em something that, I've been doing this recently. So something that made you think of them. And real, maybe it's something they mentioned about that sports team or about that golf course, or about a food item, or about their city, or about their industry, or about their product, or about their approach to outreach or a book that they, me, whatever it may be. And you should ask the right questions so you could follow up about this stuff. But then it feels personal. It doesn't feel like spam, it doesn't feel like a bot. So you wanna set yourself up to have the right material to follow up with later. But at the same time, it is all in the follow up. Absolutely. I'm behind. I, I, what brings to mind is a year ago I was following up with event planners. They're basically the people that booked me for the gigs that I do across the country. And sure, I haven't heard from this event planner for seven months. And I did my outreach, I did my consistency. I did all my emailing, my everything else, and crickets, not a note. Nothing. And seven months later I got an email from her, like we were talking yesterday, just Hey, Mike, how you doing? Oh, I just, I have a job for you and da. I'm like, where have you been? But because I remained consistent, that's how she kept in mind. Okay. Go ahead. Oh, didn't wanna take away from the next question. Oh, but timing. I have friends that I've known for decades and do I see them every day? No. Some of 'em I don't see every year. There may be years that passed by, but when I see them, and this is what reminded me of it, it feels like no time has passed. Maybe we have some updates. Maybe our lives are a little bit different, but our relationship fe feels the same. And friends come in and out of life, some safe for the right reasons. It's a good friend and at the right time. And I find the same thing in business where if I start to get offended, I haven't heard from this friend, may, maybe they don't like me anymore, I haven't heard from this business. Maybe they don't wanna work forward, maybe they don't wanna work with us or move forward. Those are just games. My brain is playing with me and sometimes it's just, Hey, that wasn't the right timing. They were busy with other. Things when we talk they mentioned to me, I've been following your podcast, or, I was really busy back then, but now is the perfect moment. We should be doing this together. So you never know what you're gonna miss if those follow ups aren't occurring. Yeah. It's funny I post all my podcasts all over. I have I over 125 of them. I'm not over the 200 mark yet, like you, but I'm getting close. But every once in a while, a friend of mine from years past, we'll reach out and said, saw your podcast, loved it. Just a quick little simple, so that's one way of keeping in touch. Where do most professionals unintentionally break trust after the first meeting? Where do most professionals break trust after the first meeting? The first thing that comes to mind for me is inconsistency, not just in follow ups, but communication style. Okay. If I feel like someone was putting on a show for me during that first meeting, during that first discussion, and they are now talking, writing in a different way in later emails, in later meetings, in later calls during an actual engagement, which you know, is not the bottom of the funnel, it's not the end of the path we wanna keep working with. Them ongoing. We have to, if we wanna use the word selling, continue selling them and conveying value and showing what's possible next. But if the communication style changes I start to lose some trust. I feel like I don't know them at least the image I had built in that first meeting. And I'm talking about me as the audience member. I, I try to be the same person. In all of my conversations so I don't have to think back and, okay, who was I with this person? There's an element of mirroring with my tonality and pace cadence, I should say. People who talk fast don't wanna hear you talk slow and there's different styles of me, but it's still me in all those conversations because I want to be consistent in the same person. And if this strategic partner. Hops on the call. I would say they're on a panel with me with a different one. And, sales call, they bring a client. It's always the same person they're getting. I find that leads to much greater trust. Yeah. You don't, there's an old saying that if you're a liar. You don't remember your lies. Yep. So you, in business, you have to be yourself because for you to keep track of everything that you said, if you're not telling the truth, it becomes far more difficult for you to understand it and reiterate what you even said. So be the truth. Be yourself. Be authentic, and look if they want you, if they wanna hire you, that's great. If not, that's all right too. But you have to remember to keep straight. Okay. You use content and digital presence to support networking. Yes. How can someone make their online presence, reinforce the relationship before they even meet in person, before they meet in person? Reinforce the relationship. I don't really get asked that question. Just thinking it out loud here I've done similar. I've done this type of thing for conferences. So if I'm gonna be on a panel, let's say with four other thought leaders and a panelist, I'll do a LinkedIn post and I'll tag those four panelists in the. Panelists and talk about how excited I am to speak alongside them and what we're gonna cover and why people should be tuning in or buying tickets or whatever it looks like. I think that's the primary way I've done this in the past and. I'd recommend for everybody to have a LinkedIn account. Of course, I think LinkedIn is underrated and the type of outreach you can do, finding the right individuals, what you could do with data partners to then do 10 other types of marketing to them afterwards, if you wanted to link LinkedIn is unmatched. I don't know if I would post before every meeting, but if I were. Going to some type of event. Let's say it's a golf tournament business networking event, that may be the right type of scenario to say, Hey, looking forward to playing with this gentleman over here. Or, you could do that leading up to a meeting. You could do a post about the brand. I've had individuals on my podcast my company has posted campaigns from companies brands that we have not worked with and I was about to meet. So look what these guys are doing. We love it. And for these reasons, authentically. But being able to show that type of promotion people have done that for me as well too. They've tagged me in posts and for different questions, and then I've answered there as well too. So I would say some type of online promotion about what you guys are gonna be doing together or just about what they're doing. If someone was meeting with me this afternoon and, even if I didn't see if they mentioned in the meeting, Hey, I did this post about you earlier. I really liked this podcast episode. Hey, we sent out an email earlier. I sent one of your ads as an example to our email subscribers. I. Wow, that's really cool. I can't tell you how many meetings I hop into where I feel like the other side doesn't know me or who I am, and that's fine. We're gonna know each other. But the fact that you did that research and you're able to point out this quote, it's really a standout. So I would say something in that fashion. Okay. Alright, so let's change a little bit for after you meet someone how should digital touchpoints email, LinkedIn, or even just a shared content? Continue the conversation instead of replacing it. So it goes back to frequency. I wanna find the right channel to converse, and that's gonna vary based on someone's communication style based on who they are, where they are, time zones or factor here. When do I want to call them? When do I want to text? When do I want to email? When do I want to text message? Maybe they're local. They're down the street. When do I wanna stop by? When do I wanna invite 'em to lunch? I want to build up some type of strategy. Maybe I'm doing it for different audience personas and having different approach for a category of prospects. So I'm not reinventing the wheel each time, although if you have the ability to, I would, this is about customization. It's about personalization. I don't wanna call somebody every day. I could text them if there's value. Email is a special communication channel where it's somewhat timeless. You could email somebody at off hours. You can be brief, you can be long, you can have headlines in there, and some bolding. There's a different writing format that I use for email than I would use for an article or a longer form content piece. So I can give a few baseline pieces of copy and then attach something that's much longer. I wouldn't do that in a text message. I'd have to have the time available for both sides on the phone. So I think it's the right channel for the right time. Email also allows for a bit more frequency, maybe not more than text messaging, but it depends on who you're going after. But for a, a, a. Less responsive audience. You could stay in touch there weekly. I would still talk about what you're going to do next together. The call to action may be around a phone call. I felt at times I say that too much but I personally can get more done. In that type of verbal discussion, even in a few minutes, then a bunch of emails going back and forth. So I think it's using email for frequency to be concise, but to add more content as necessary, and then looking to do an in-person or a call from there. Okay good. Let's bring this podcast full circle. If a listener wants to build a network that produces steady referrals and partnerships over the next year, what's one habit would have? The what? One habit would have the greatest long-term impact? I would tell you the habit is around organization. If you are setting time for yourself, once a month, once a week, once a day. To really iron out your plan, look at the results determine what you need to change up from there, you are gonna be putting a lot more effort into it than most people. And I believe the quality will be much stronger than if you just continued these activities without really asking yourself what you're getting out of it. IE pre pandemic, I was. Doing conferences, speaking at them constantly. And I would see some of the same people at every conferences, at every conference. And some of them would talk about these events and tell me they didn't really get anything out of it. And I'd ask 'em about their follow up process. And I literally heard, I just wait for people to follow up with me. I feel like they're selling themselves short by doing that. And they were going to so many events, it was hard to keep organized. I would tell them what I was doing. They'd say, wow. Some of them been asked for my agency to do it for them. I have a, a very detailed set of instructions for one of our sales reps going to an event and how many people they should be speaking to throughout the course what they need to be determining for, from each conversation in regards to what needs to happen for follow up, not rushing the chats, looking to have that real relationship building occur. Being able to have some measurements at the end of each day, and then what they do with the contacts from there, and how many follow ups. Then we're reviewing it each week from there and for all the events that they're going to. So I would tell you that step is missed, even though it sounds basic. You can then look at the results. I do this for our marketing. Just talk about ours and what we do to, build referral partnerships. I have the weekly podcast, monthly webinar. We put out an article every other week. We run search advertising. We're on social advertising. We're in banner retargeting. I from the Forbes Agency Council and part of the Crowdfund Professional Association Global Equity Crowdfund. Alliance Senior Executive, a list of different places. I can get content out. I wanna see what it's producing for me. I have a weekly meeting where my team treats me as the client and we go through all of it. We look at the numbers, our outreach campaigns on email and LinkedIn. All the calls that I had with prospects, with partners. It's all put in there, the results of those calls. I think putting that infrastructure into place, then exploring which of these channels, among others you want to incorporate into your strategic partner development program is going to make all the difference. You could even invite third parties to those calls or you could. Can run the call through AI and have it analyzed. You can have a consultant analyze the call and tell you, different things that can be approved upon. But without that system, you're just hoping the partners come to you. Ion this was great. This was a great podcast I was listening to. The good thing, this is this is recorded because I'm gonna have to rehash everything you said, because it's so in line with what I talk about that I'm sure I'm picking up bits and pieces, and I'm probably gonna put it into my talks and my workshops. If somebody wants to get hold of you either to ask for your services, be coached by you, or just to say hi, what's the best way that they get hold of you? Sure. I would say find me on LinkedIn, Jason Fishman, DNA, marina del Rey. You could also access my content. I would go to youtube.com/at Digital Niche Agency, you could see my playlist of webinars over 60. Podcast guest appearances digital niche agency.com gives us a lot more information on what we do and access to these content pieces. It'll show all the latest there. Fantastic. This conversation is a reminder that the real value of networking isn't the first meeting. It's what happens after. Trust grows through small, steady actions, staying in touch, keeping your word, and showing up consistently. Stay. Take one step this week, reach out to someone you met recently, and continue the conversation not to sell, just to strengthen the relationship. Long-term opportunity often starts with simple consistency. If you found value in today's episode, be sure to like, follow and subscribe to Networking Unleashed, building Profitable Connections, so you keep getting practical insight on networking and communication. And share this episode with someone who wants more than quick wins. If you want lasting business relationships, if you'd like to help improve how you communicate and build professional connections, visit michaelaforman.com. Learn how I work with professionals. Teams and organizations. So until next time, stay consistent, build trust, and great, and. Create connections that keep working for you long after the introduction. Jason, thank you so much for coming on the podcast. I had a blast. Feeling is mutual. Michael love what you're doing, what you're recommending to different business owners and it was a, honor to be part of. Thank you.  hold on folks. Don't go anywhere. Let's hear from our sponsors. David Neal, co-founder Revved Up Kids. Revved Up Kids is on a mission to protect children and teens from sexual abuse, exploitation, and trafficking. They provide prevention, training programs for children, teens, and adults. To learn more, go to RevD up kids.org. Henry Kaplan Century 21. When it comes to making the biggest financial decision of your life, leave it in the hands of a proven professional. Henry Kaplan Henry is a global real estate agent with Century 21, celebrating his 41st year in business. No matter where you're moving, Henry has a right, has the right connections for you. You can contact Henry at 5 6 1- 4 2 7- 4 8 8 8.   a huge thank you to our guests for sharing such incredible insights today, and of course, a big shout out to you, our amazing listeners, for tuning in and spending your time with us. If you're interested in my digital courses being coached or having me come and talk to your company, just go to MichaelAForman.com and fill out the request form. Remember, networking isn't about being perfect. It's about being present. So take what you've learned today, get out there and make some meaningful connections. If you've enjoyed this episode, please don't forget to subscribe. Leave us a review. Share it with someone who could use a little networking inspiration. Let's keep the conversation going. You can find me on Apple, Spotify, Pandora, YouTube, or my website michaelaforman.com/podcast.