Networking Unleashed: Building Profitable Connections. An Interview with Randall Avery and Michael A Forman

 Welcome to Networking Unleashed, building Profitable Connections, the show where conversations turn into opportunities and relationships turn into real revenue. I'm your host, Michael Foreman, and this isn't about collecting business cards or chasing the room. It's about learning how to connect with purpose, speak with confidence, and build relationships that actually move your business forward.

Today's episode goes straight at a topic most professionals avoid and pay for later money, conversations, confidence, and the role networking plays in both income and wellbeing. My guest has lived it. Transitioning from corporate finance into entrepreneurship by taking ownership, building the right relationships, and learning how to talk about money without hesitation.

If you want stronger connections, smarter choices and opportunities that find you. You're in the right place. I'd like to welcome Randall Avery to the podcast Randall. I'm so happy to have you on the podcast because this is so very important to not only my listeners, but to everyone. If you don't mind, could you give yourself an introduction and tell us how you got here today?

So first of all, thank you for having me today. I've listened to a lot of your podcasts. I think this message, the message of getting out there, talking to people, building junior relationships important and it's even more important than my journey and how I got to doing what I'm doing today. So I start off my career in internal audit.

So a lot of people think internal audit as the bad guy. So somebody, people going in and we used to. Audit our external distributors. So I was really the bad guy coming into their distributing, asking for invoices. So what does that teach you? How do people react when they're uncomfortable? How to disarm people because a lot of situation we're gonna come in as entrepreneurs, as the professionals, people are not going to be as welcoming.

So that experience was important. I learned about checks and balances and business in general. After myin in internal audit, I did corporate fp and a, so that's really studying p and ls and really providing the analysis for the business unit owners to make better decisions. Now why is that important?

That's because I supported different type of. Personalities, whether that's a person who manages sales operations, product marketing, different type of personalities, who has different preferences on how they see numbers, and more importantly how they want to hear about numbers. Now, did that for about seven years, and now I'm a personal financial planner.

Been doing this for about 10 years. I sit with individuals, specifically business owners, and explain to them their numbers and how they can better win with money. And I use all those communication skills. 'cause let's be honest, initially a lot of people don't want to talk to a financial planner. But as they get, we move forward.

I understand who they are, what drives them. That's how I show them the correct numbers to actually win in life. Wow. That's great. That's great. We can probably do an entire podcast just on that. Yes. Okay. But first let's move into this my, the questions that I've developed for you.

Why do so many professionals avoid money conversations and what actually changes when they learn to talk about money and with confidence and clarity? A lot of people are uneasy about money because to be honest, they've made a lot of money mistakes and they don't internalize it. That's fine 'cause everybody has made money mistakes, but they internalize and they think about what could have been again and again over and over their head.

So to really open up and say, Hey, this is what I've done with money, or this is where I am with my money, is scary for a lot of people. 'cause we assume everybody's doing well with money. We assume everybody has a beautiful home, nice car, kids are can go to all the activities in the world. But that's just not the case.

And as a financial planner, I get to see directly how people struggling with money. Even people who make a lot of income and have a lot of assets, money is still a sticking issue. I think the second reason is also we have been taught money behaviors a lot of times from our parents. How they use money, how they leverage debt how the insecurity within the household When money was stressed, parents tell me all the time, I try to not let my kids feel anything about money, but we can go into a home and.

Feel financial stress. So we feel it as children and actually we've actually transitioned to adults and make money mistakes. That's why money conversations are so hard for adults. It's true, and you, you hit a point, you learn about money from your parents and if your parents didn't really know, they either gave you the wrong information or they didn't give you any information at all, so you had to go a find out for yourself.

But unless you were self-employed or. Work for somebody else that it really never came up. It comes up not until you're like 30 or 40 years old when you say I better really find out what I'm doing. So what you're doing is so very important. And the younger they start, the better. That's one thing.

In your experience, how does being comfortable discussing money instantly shift how others perceive your credibility and leadership in a networking setting? I think it goes with any topic. People think, money's isolated. It's this unique thing. But think about your business as you open and are honest on any aspect of your business, how your marketing, how your sales opening up about that makes you seem a little bit more genuine and people are willing to open up with you.

So if you talk to people about your money. Specifically, let's talk to business owners about how much money you're making. What are your expenses? What are your profit lines? You have those conversations. People will open up and actually trust you even more. Because they realize, like we discussed earlier, the normal person is not going to open up.

So when somebody opens up a show, that level of vulnerability, that's when you can receive a little bit of automatic trust. And if you not only open up, but take advice, you'll be that person's best friend. And really the way you communicate with them is so very important. You can't just start spouting all these financial anything, all these big words.

And they'll say okay, thank you, you didn't help me. You have to really find that level, find that, that level of trust in networking, know you, like you, trust you. They'll do business with you. Your level of trust is so much higher because when you're dealing with financials, that just means that okay, I don't discuss financials with anybody.

So you have to break through that wall. And once they trust you, then you're in. And I think it starts off, a lot of people lead with, oh I bring in so much of revenue, or I have so many clients. May I say, suggest, start with a vulnerability. This is an issue I'm having with my p and l. This is an issue I'm having with my personal finance.

This is something I'm confused about investing. If you start from a, the perspective of taking on advice, I think it'll work out better if you're trying to build a relationship than showing that, Hey, I have it all figured out when that's usually not the case. Very good. Very good point. And yes, that would be a great way to break the ice and kind of break into that conversation.

Okay. Can you share a moment where an open money conversation directly created a better opportunity, stronger relationship, or faster trust? Yeah. One of my I coined him as a mentor. I was a mentor at the time and we were just discussing business. Profit loss, clients as a financial planner, you get compensated in many different ways, but the two, my primary ways of your fee only is you do a fixed fee.

Meaning you just charge a fee and they do a plan. I can do asset under management. And I was describing to him like, Hey, the fixed fee, there's a lot of churn. How can I do asset under management? I use this custodian, but all the other custodians require minimums. He said Randall. Have you ever looked at the the custodian I use right now is Charles Schwab, and I said, no.

I thought they had minimums. They're like, no. They recently just waived it. And I think this is important for the audience you don't know what you don't know. Somebody's gonna know something that you don't know. So if you're, like I said, take the approach of being vulnerable. I don't know it all. I actually have this problem, people are going to quickly try to solve your issue, especially business owners.

'cause we are so wired to say, problem, solution, problem, solution. It is impossible. I think every person is listening. Their spouse probably knows this if they're a business owner, you're always thinking about solution. So if you approach somebody with the problem, be honest and obey, I'm having this profitability issue.

You'll be surprised what they give you. I agree. I agree. I also, I feel that every bi business owner, I'm saying owner because I don't wanna make it too big, but every business owner should get a mentor. Should get somebody that they can look to or be third party and say Mike, why'd you do that?

Because this is a better way. Or, have you tried this or, I can't be there with you. But as you said, Charles Schwab just waived her fees. Now, you would never have known that unless you had that person to speak with. You need mentors really in every aspect of your business and your life.

There's some mentors who are great at marketing, some are sales, some are operations, some of them more the technical side, and you probably need a mentor in every aspect of your personal life as well. Don't, I would say have multiple mentors. 'cause one person cannot be the be all, end all for your life.

And you just need those different perspectives. But the key thing is a mentorship will not work unless you're honest, unless you're vulnerable. And also that you reciprocate, meaning that you actually listen fall direction and also show that, hey, I see you have this problem. I can provide you with this advice.

And mentorship relationships should evolve into a symbiotic relationship where you guys are all winning because you're all grown. Absolutely. And you made another good point. You have to listen to what they say. If it's good advice, follow through with it. Because if somebody's giving me advice and I never listen to it, how long do you think he's gonna stick around?

But that's, you just really should take all the, you're right. Multiple mentors to, to handle multiple problems within your business. You connect networking to both personal wellbeing and income. What's the unseen link between the quality of our relationships and the quality of our financial decisions?

And this shouldn't be a surprise to this audience here. Opportunity comes through connection. You obtain a job through going through an interview process connected with somebody you attained a client by doing some type of sales process or some type of way that you, they feel connected with you to make a purchase.

You cannot connect economic opportunity from relationships. So that is, I think, the key to everything. The second thing is. Let's say you're able to make a lot of sales. Life is not fun unless you have genuine connection with folks. People love to do business with people they enjoy doing business with.

So I would rather make 50% less income, but really enjoy eight hours outta my day than making, twice as much and not enjoying that. So think about. People also want to enjoy their life. So if you mix great relationships, enjoying the job, what you're doing, how can you not enjoy life more?

Now, the counter is if you don't have those things, that's where I see the negative money behaviors, different uses of different alcoholism or are doing things with your money that you, that are not wise. Those are the symptoms of that I'm not fulfilled in my job and I don't have fulfilling relationships.

So they, it's hard to separate the two. The, it's really a crutch, right? The alcoholism, the drug use something else. Yes, you're spending a lot of money in that wasted money, but you're using that as a crutch. So there are several issues you have to take care of, but that's one thing. You have to use your money smartly.

I, there's a saying that I bring up whenever I do workshops or anything, people hate to be sold to. Yes. But they love to buy. People love to buy, but they hate. Just think of that car salesman. When you walk through the showroom floor, he comes right up to you with a business card and say, Hey, I'm Joe Schmo.

Look at this Cadillac. Oh, it's got great, it's this. You want to take a ride because I can take you a ride. This is what, just, lemme get my manager. And I'll just, I'm like. Stop or the salesman that walks up and says, Hey Randall, how are you? If you have a problem, let me know. I'll be right over there.

And you go off and do undr. And those are two things. So people hate to be sold to, but they love to buy. I think one of the things that I've learned through a lot of my sales training is people we. I think naturally as entrepreneurs and people have something to sell, we wanna show up and be the hero in people's lives.

But nobody wants you to be the hero. What they really want is a trusted guide. And once I switch from selling to guiding, and actually sometimes I may guide them away from me, but as long as I'm guiding them, providing my expertise, staying in my line and say, Hey, I'm the financial expert. This is what the guy, these are the places you can go.

And also I have this. I think if people switch their mind to being guides instead of being the superhero or trying to show up as the superhero in the room, you'll get more, become more receptive and become more likable, to be honest with you. Absolutely you. You become more of a likable person.

You have to it like when you're going to a networking event, you're always trying to get onto the same level as them. And I use something called FORM, family Occupation. Recreation and a certain message, you try to get onto the same level. They're husband, wife, sister, brother, son, daughter, whatever. I talk about youth sports.

I was a baseball coach for 16 years, an umpire for another three years. So once you get onto youth sports, that's what I'll talk about and I'll talk all day on it. They never feel like, they're like, oh, he's, he demands my attention. They want to give me that information. So it's all how you take it.

What separates surface level connections from relationships that consistently lead to referrals, partnerships, and shared wins? I think it's win two people. Come together and they always think about what I can give. They're never focusing on keeping score on what they're receiving, but I'm saying, Hey, I genuinely like this person and I just want them to do well.

And when both parties take that approach, it becomes a beautiful self-fulfilling cycle that goes on and on. Because if you think of somebody who's always looking for somebody's best interest. They usually, for that to be in that mentality, they usually have to have something going for themselves so that checks that box so they're not in a deficit.

So two people are not in a deficit looking to better the other person continuously. I think over time and not keeping score, because it could be five years, one person is helping out one person on the other, could be another five years, the other person's helping out. Another, just to bring the story full circle.

That mentor told me about Charles Schwab. He's a college professor now, and guess who goes and lecture at his classes every single year. You see how that cycle continues to go back and forth over again. So if you're always looking to give, I think that's when a beautiful relationship happens.

That's known as having a servant's heart. Yes. When you go to a networking event, I keep, say, I keep going back to networking events, but you use this in any part of networking. By having a servant's heart, you're looking to help everybody else. You're not looking to sell anything. You're not looking to give anything.

Just Randall, I like you. I like how you do business. I like what you do. How can I make you more successful? How can I be a good referral source for you? And if I did my job correctly, you'll turn around and say, Mike, I don't even know what the hell you do yet, and you're trying to make me more successful.

Yes. So that's having a servant's heart that is looking to help everybody. And Zig Ziglar is big with this. What goes around comes around. Because if I helped you, you'll feel compelled to say, oh, Mike, help me. I have to find somebody for Mike. So it that's, but what you just described is having a servant's heart.

Yes. Correct. Okay. Can professionals intentionally build networks that support not just growth, but better judgment, confidence, and long-term stability? I think, there is a bit, of course you wanna always give. But what we talked about earlier, once you give somebody listens and they put into practice and you see that growth, guess what happens?

You're gonna be attracted to those people who listen and grow. Listen and grow. Listen and grow until eventually, hopefully, if you're being mindful, your whole circle is just listening and growing together. So if you are foc, if you are that person. You're gonna begin being around other people.

So it creates little networks where all you are, what we call, high performers could be another corporate word for that. Or somebody who are just winning in life. That's what should happen over time. You're hanging around people who are listening, you are also listening and winning as well.

And then that's how those semiotic win-win relationships happen. Absolutely. I couldn't agree with you more. Okay. You made the shift from corporate finance to entrepreneurship. How did your network influence your willingness to take ownership risk and responsibility? To be honest so I, I did initially I did pretty well for myself in the corporate world.

So when everybody knows you as the corporate person. Then telling them that, Hey, I'm going to take away the title of the corporation and start your own business. A lot of people are hesitant, they're scared, they're fearful because one they don't know and they're saying that, that's a route I haven't heard.

But the route you were going on, I've heard, been successful a hundred times over again. So the initial was, are you sure that you have a headstand? Are you sure that you wanna make that move after that? Then they begin to watch you and they've slowly become to support you. They say, okay, he's serious.

And I think the biggest thing is once you begin getting results, and that's the hardest thing, going from zero to results for your clients or whatever you wanna serve. Once that results, that's when you know, they say the flywheel begins to spin faster and faster. But getting from zero to getting results for people, I think that's the challenge.

And once you start getting results, that's when the support, I believe, explodes. You're right, and you could say support. I say credibility. You need that credibility for somebody to trust you in order to get somebody to trust you. It's a whole big cycle, but once you start that cycle, once you start forging forward, there's no stopping you unless you stop it.

So unless you have, unless you say, okay enough is enough, your clients will see you building and building, and you'll get more and more clients. That's the way I've seen every business start. That's the way that I started with speaking and everything else. I had to first build my credibility looking back.

What networking habits helped you move from employee thinking to owner thinking faster than anything else in the corporate space? You know this, it's about speed networking, it's about, quick hits. What can you do for me? All those different things. Who do I know you, and they, and what in the corporate space, they don't teach you about sales.

They don't teach you how to truly build relationships. And when people think of building relationships in business, they, it's a gray area, but I'm just gonna pull back the fail. Build relationships as you're building with the personal friend that you grew up for kids. So what do you guys do?

You guys go out to eat with each other. You guys share hobbies with each other. You guys are vulnerable with each other. You guys do these different things. Those are the exact same things you have to do to build a relationship and that, and I think the difference was, I didn't know you had to massage and work at it.

So it's natural with the friends that you grew up with. 'cause you guys have a rhythm and a flow. You actually have to create a rhythm and the flow with each new person that you really want to build that intimate connection and it takes time and it is almost like nurturing a garden.

You have to till the soil. You have to plant the seed, you have to water it, and you have to look and watch. And the watching is the headache, but that is what you have to do to build a relationship that is not corporate. But actually as far as an entrepreneur, which is exactly what I do. Is exactly all the networking, all the, everything else, what I talk about and everything else.

So what you just said about building that relationship, ever since the pandemic people have gone from transactional to relationship and the relationship for me is so much more rewarding than transactional because you get closer. But that's exactly. What you have to do to build your relationship, to build your clientele.

I'd rather have 10 clients like that than a hundred clients. Transactional. Yes. Because the relationship will go further. Yes. Okay. For someone still employed, but filling the pull towards independence, what small networking moves can they start making now without burning bridges? I think the number one thing I would recommend is find somebody who does what you do.

Literally cold call them. Does somebody something that you want to do and literally cold call them and reach out to them and say, Hey, I'm looking to do what you do. How did you get started? The natural corporate employee mentality is like, why would they tell me anything? They'd be, I'd be their competitor.

But you'll be surprised that people, especially entrepreneurs, will open up and say, Hey, this is how I did it. This is how I recommend, and this is how to adjust. And if I started day zero today, these are the steps that I can do. And don't just take that for one person, take that from multiple people, and then after that, continue to keep in contact with them.

Nurture that story. Take 'em out to a coffee, tell 'em how you do this. And even go as far as, do you have a project that you need help on? So what are you doing? You're getting somebody who can vouch for you and you're also gaining some potential practical, real world experience. You put those two together, you will have a level of confidence when confidence, when you step out, that you won't have if you just make a jump or a leap.

Absolutely. Absolutely. Some of the, some of my coaching clients when they're trying to attract people on LinkedIn or something else like that. People are always willing to discuss what they do. If you called me and said, Mike, how did you do this with networking? Or, what about this networking event, or something else?

I take that as I'm the professional. That means that you're coming to me for help. I'm going to open up. I'm gonna give you everything that I can. That's the way Ev I believe. Personally, every employer or every person in that type of position would do. They would just open up. Would you mind if I had a cup of coffee with you?

Not at all. Sure. Come on. Buy. I'll spill my guts, if they're close enough. Can I buy a lunch? And you can discuss things over lunch. Absolutely. That is the best way to get and start building your relationship and build that kind of, that, that work relationship where he, that person can also become a mentor.

And people say our word what if they don't respond? What if they think about it this way. You probably don't want to socialize with somebody who wouldn't help you out. And the second thing is they may be in a point in their life whether they're slammed at work, maybe they have some personal matters that they probably need that space.

So don't take it personally, just know that it's part of the process. If you're going to be an entrepreneur, getting used to being ghosted or rejected may be a skillset you may wanna develop. So it's a win-win across the board. It can get a thicker skin, that's the best way to say it.

Just a little bit thicker, and if you get ghosted, if they don't answer you. Alright, so you know what? You tried it you move on to somebody else. Okay, let's bring this full circle. Yeah. If you could give one networking principle that improves both income and peace of mind at the same time, what would it be and why does it work?

As entrepreneurs, we may have a typical plot client base. One thing that I would recommend is try to punch up. Ask for that client that may be slightly above your usual client base network with somebody who's slightly above where you are as an entrepreneur. And if you always try to network and punch up, I think you'll be surprised at who's open to share things with you as we discussed.

And also where what may fall into your lap and in your hands. 'cause people are always looking for people to help. Key thing is you have to listen. You have to follow through, and you have to show fruit. If you show fruit, there'll be a lot of people eating in your garden, I promise you. Absolutely.

Absolutely. This is why networking done right changes everything. It's not about who you know. It's about how you show up, what you're willing to talk about, and the trust you built through real conversation. If today's episode made you rethink your approach. How you approach money, relationships, or the next step in your career, don't keep it to yourself.

Share this episode with someone who needs to hear it. Make sure you sub subscribe to Networking Unleashed, building Pro Profitable Connections, so you never miss a conversation that can shift away. You connect and earn. If you're ready to make that your, take your networking skills to a higher level, visit me, michael a foreman.com and learn how I work with professionals, teams, and organizations.

Until next time, show up with intention, speak with confidence, and build connections that pay off. But. Before we leave Randall, if somebody wanted your services, wanted to get in touch with you, what's the best way they can get in touch with you? Thank you for this opportunity. My name is Randall Ry. I'm a certified financial planner and charter financial analyst.

If you wanna reach to me, if you're a business owner looking to build wealth if you're looking to more strategies on how to grow your wealth and your business, you can go to my website. It's going to be ww dot dea SI wm.com. That's DASI lw m.com. I'm also all social media. Just look under my name, Randall Lavery and you can find me, follow my content, learn a little bit more how I think and how I help business owners grow their wealth.

That's perfect. Randall, thank you so much. I learned so much by having you on this podcast so we can probably have another two hour talk. But thank you very much for coming on a podcast and I hope you do well in the future. Take care. Thank you for having

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 Folks. A huge thank you to our guests for sharing such incredible insights today, and of course, a big shout out to you, our amazing listeners, for tuning in and spending your time with us. If you're interested in my digital courses being coached or having me come and talk to your company, just go to MichaelAForman.com and fill out the request form.

Remember, networking isn't about being perfect. It's about being present. So take what you've learned today, get out there and make some meaningful connections. If you've enjoyed this episode, please don't forget to subscribe. Leave us a review. Share it with someone who could use a little networking inspiration.

Let's keep the conversation going. You can find me on Apple, Spotify, Pandora, YouTube, or my website michaelaforman.com/podcast.

Michael is a business networking expert specializing in enhancing professionals' networking and communication skills to drive profitability. As a leading authority in this field, he is highly sought after for his dynamic presentations and workshops. His extensive experience has consistently led to significant improvements in corporate profitability by empowering individuals and organizations to connect more effectively and efficiently.

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